Archive:Marketing meetings/2008-08-26 transcript

[11:02] <jbrockmeier> Who's here for the marketing meeting? [11:02] <rhorstkoetter> here [11:02] <alexio44> me :D [11:03] <suseROCKs> here, but have to step away for about 5 minutes momentarily. [11:03] --> notlocalhorst has joined this channel (n=notlocal@nat/suse/x-65944d169a5adb79). [11:03] <The_Code> here [11:03] <benJIman> o/ [11:03] <s_matsumoto> here [11:03] <suseROCKs> awesome! benJIman's here! [11:03] <jbrockmeier> notlocalhorst: you joining for Marketing meeting? We're taking roll :-0 [11:03] <jbrockmeier> er, :-) [11:04] <jbrockmeier> anyone else? [11:04] <suseROCKs> decriptor: are you here? [11:04] <alexio44> hold hands geekos around the world ;) [11:04] <alexio44> We are here gathering to RULE the world [11:04] <alexio44> Making it a GREEN and BETTER world [11:04] <FunkyPenguin> jbrockmeier: in response to your question, busy and not much produced :( way too much time speaking to people - should be called chatweek :) [11:04] <elchevive1968> me.. [11:04] <alexio44> (sorry for the flood :P) [11:04] <suseROCKs> kumbaya... my lord... kuuuuuumbaya! [11:04] <jbrockmeier> OK - let's get started, thanks everyone for joining [11:05] <jbrockmeier> Let's go through the agenda: http://en.opensuse.org/Marketing_Team#Meetings [11:05] <jbrockmeier> First topic: openSUSE Local groups [11:05] --> ccoray has joined this channel (n=chatzill@nat/novell/x-289f90ccbbb8155b). [11:05] <jbrockmeier> and localization for non-English speaking locales. [11:05] *** ChanServ gives channel operator privileges to Beineri. [11:06] [Whois] alexio44 is n=alex@inim.gob.ni (purple) [11:06] [Whois] alexio44 is a user on channels: #openSUSE-project #opensuse-es #suse-ni #ubuntu-ni [11:06] [Whois] alexio44 is online via irc.freenode.net (http://freenode.net/). [11:06] [Whois] alexio44 is an identified user. [11:06] [Whois] alexio44 is an identified user. [11:06] [Whois] End of WHOIS list. [11:06] *** Beineri sets the channel topic to "Welcome to the openSUSE marketing meeting: http://en.opensuse.org/Marketing_Team#Meetings". [11:06] *** Beineri gives channel operator privileges to you. [11:06] <jbrockmeier> We need to start working on boosting local groups, and working with the translation team on creating localized materials [11:07] <jbrockmeier> who has been heading local groups? [11:07] <alexio44> me [11:07] <jbrockmeier> alexio44: have you been in touch with the translation team about any of the translation issues/ [11:07] <jbrockmeier> ? [11:07] <alexio44> actually it was my agenda item to be discussed ... because i have the experience getting along with a local group [11:07] <alexio44> yes [11:07] <jbrockmeier> alexio44: you have the floor :-) [11:08] <alexio44> i am in the translation team (spanish), BUT ... we realized that a lot of topics and manuals (at NOVELLs) does not come in spanish [11:09] <elchevive1968> includin the pdfs in the repos...only en and de... [11:09] <alexio44> at the lists opensuse-es, and IRC opensuse-es [11:09] <alexio44> we have a lot of people asking for official manuals in their languaje ... :s [11:10] <jbrockmeier> alexio44: is the translation team willing to work on the official manuals? [11:10] <alexio44> it's very sad, tell them, that they have to learnd english to do a thing in openSUSE [11:10] <elchevive1968> in pt_BR for example, these materials existed in 10.2 but where not available since 10.3... (since they open the pt_BR translation to community...) [11:11] <yaloki> alexio44: I think we all realize that it is a problem ;) [11:11] <jbrockmeier> alexio44, elchevive1968 - yes, it is a problem - do you have any proposals? [11:11] <yaloki> let's not whine but find solutions or at least identify blockers [11:12] <elchevive1968> jbrockmeier: translate them. I don't know how they are done, if using .po files or written in a .odf... [11:12] <yaloki> isn't it written in novbook ? [11:12] <yaloki> (a subset of docbook) [11:12] <alexio44> my solution for the language problems = set an extra task for the translation team, choosing the better manuals to give to the openSUSE users [11:13] <elchevive1968> I see these issue with the man pages of zypper for example... only english, although the zypper help is translated [11:13] <alexio44> speccially those for FIRST users .... [11:13] <elchevive1968> alexio44: I think the first step would be ones included in the package opensuse-manuals_en [11:13] * suseROCKs is back [11:14] <elchevive1968> there are 5 or 6 little manuals for begginers... [11:14] <jbrockmeier> OK - elchevive1968, alexio44 - so we need to coordinate with the translation team better, try to get more materials translated, yes? [11:14] <alexio44> exact elchevive1968 ..... the better way to keep the new linux opensuse users is provide them with the complete initial manual in their language [11:14] <elchevive1968> jbrockmeier: yes [11:15] <yaloki> is there any limitation on getting the sources of the manuals ? did anyone check that ? [11:15] <jbrockmeier> elchevive1968, alexio44 are either / both of you part of the translation teams? [11:15] <alexio44> i am [11:15] <elchevive1968> yeah..i'm a coordinator of pt_BR team [11:15] --> lulyis has joined this channel (n=lulyis@200.188.223.85.rev.neoviatelecom.com.br). [11:15] <alexio44> I am part of team in SPANISH [11:15] <jbrockmeier> alexio44, elchevive1968 - have you had any problems getting sources? [11:16] <alexio44> !sources [11:16] <SUSEhelp> For a complete guide on adding all the necessary repositories, see http://opensuse-community.org/Repositories [11:16] <elchevive1968> for the distro no... [11:16] <jbrockmeier> alexio44, elchevive1968 for the manuals. [11:16] <s_matsumoto> And http://software.opensuse.org/ is only in English. [11:16] <jbrockmeier> ? [11:16] <elchevive1968> but that is only what we have for translation... [11:17] <alexio44> jbrockmeier: They are hosted at novells docs [11:17] <elchevive1968> I never tried... [11:17] <alexio44> or they are different from the SUSE.de manuals ? [11:17] <jbrockmeier> http://en.opensuse.org/Documentation#Documentation_Source_Files_in_XML [11:17] <elchevive1968> but I think they should be at least mentoned in i18n.opensuse.org [11:18] --> abock_ has joined this channel (n=abock@137.65.229.89). [11:18] <jbrockmeier> are those the manuals, etc. you're looking for? [11:18] <elchevive1968> jbrockmeier: I'll give a look at this later... [11:18] --> AJaeger has joined this channel (n=aj@opensuse/member/A-jaeger). [11:18] <alexio44> by the way .... there was also a french guy with the same problems but in his local language [11:18] <jbrockmeier> right [11:19] <alexio44> yes ... they are ;) [11:19] <yaloki> getting the (english) sources and the toolchain is no problem [11:19] <yaloki> but do we have the people to translate the manuals ? [11:19] <jbrockmeier> one of the things I've seen with other distros is a chart of translation progress, do we have something like that? [11:19] <suseROCKs> I don't know much about the challenges of translation, but from what I've observed with a former translator here in openSUSE, there was mostly a challenge in coordinating volunteers to do the actual work. [11:19] <yaloki> jbrockmeier: yes [11:19] <elchevive1968> jbrockmeier: yeah.. these are the manuals I'm looking for... [11:20] <jbrockmeier> yaloki: where? [11:20] <jbrockmeier> Now would be the time to start revving up for 11.1 [11:20] <yaloki> jbrockmeier: I don't remember, benJIman is trying to find it [11:20] <jbrockmeier> OK [11:20] <benJIman> http://skillingstad.no/opensuse/ was on the mail, it may have moved. [11:20] <yaloki> jbrockmeier: as always, it's well hidden ;) [11:20] <-- lulyis has left this server ("lulyis time out"). [11:20] <elchevive1968> the translation teams only works 1 or 2 months in a openSUSE cycle... [11:20] <jbrockmeier> My question to alexio44, elchevive1968, others - what about largish local Linux events [11:20] <benJIman> http://i18n.opensuse.org/stats/openSUSE-10.3/index.php there we are. [11:21] <alexio44> suseROCKs: most of the translations at the wiki and small manuals are being done by volunteers [11:21] <jbrockmeier> elchevive1968: the Novell teams, or the volunteers? [11:21] <alexio44> the volunteers for the distro translation [11:22] <alexio44> jbrockmeier: for LARGE events ! i got 2 of them ... that neither NOVELL, SUSE, openSUSE takes part ! [11:22] <elchevive1968> jbrockmeier: the volunters...Novell teams works in SUSE Linux.. [11:22] <jbrockmeier> alexio44: they are? and how large? [11:22] <alexio44> Software Freedom Day >> http://www.softwarefreedomday.org/Nicaragua/english [11:23] <alexio44> WORLD WIDE [11:23] <suseROCKs> Here's my question before we assume a solution: Is the challenge in finding enough volunteers, or is the challenge in organizing the process effectively? [11:23] --> Spyhawk has joined this channel (n=opera@84.226.253.170). [11:23] <jbrockmeier> alexio44: er, no - how many people? [11:24] <alexio44> it depends... every country coordinates the local event [11:24] <-> alexio44> yes, but how many people will be at the event you're talking about? [11:24] --> sPiN has joined this channel (n=spin@opensuse/supporter/sPiN). [11:24] <alexio44> Last year in Nicaragua .... a small country (1000 people) for the first time SFD [11:25] <alexio44> chine had a lot of people [11:25] <yaloki> alexio44: so what do you want? what do you need? [11:25] <alexio44> they coordinate a World Wide event ... this year is the september 20th [11:25] <elchevive1968> suseROCKs: the challenge is to centralize the information ;) For the distro we have i18.opensuse, for the manuals the page said before.. [11:26] <alexio44> yaloki: it's not only for me, what i prettend is to make a connection between openSUSE.org >> SFD [11:26] <yaloki> yeah but SFD doesn't matter, let's address this in general [11:26] <decriptor> ah sorry, I'm late [11:26] <alexio44> to be part of the sponsors >> http://www.softwarefreedomday.org/ [11:26] <yaloki> not just SFD but any local events [11:26] <alexio44> to get involved, like canonical, ubuntu and others [11:26] <elchevive1968> suseROCKs: to find volunteers is more or less easy..many of them shows but only a few 'do the job' [11:26] <FunkyPenguin> decriptor: 10 demerrits [11:26] <decriptor> :( [11:27] --> bitshuffler has joined this channel (n=bitshuff@unaffiliated/bitshuffler). [11:27] <jbrockmeier> alexio44: on a larger level, we should sponsor SFD, probably, but right now I'm asking about specific local events. [11:27] *** mhwork|gone is now known as mhutch. [11:27] <yaloki> how about having per-country contact persons for opensuse.org ? [11:28] <jbrockmeier> elchevive1968: OK - so... we need a single translation page, or... what are you suggesting? [11:28] <alexio44> ok .... then the SFD this year is the next 20 of september, [11:28] --> davidx has joined this channel (n=david@pdpc/supporter/active/davidx). [11:28] <alexio44> i am getting invited to go to El Salvador to give 3 talks ok openSUSE ... [11:28] <yaloki> e.g. make elchevive1968 the (or one of the) "official" opensuse.org community contact, specifically for organizing local presence at events [11:28] <alexio44> what do i need ? [11:28] <yaloki> s/contact/contacts in brazil/ [11:28] <alexio44> whatever you can send me .... [11:29] <yaloki> alexio44: please send an email on -marketing to let others know about it [11:29] <alexio44> the promoDVDs are already here, and they have been distributed along the local group [11:29] <yaloki> alexio44: I meant the email address [11:29] <alexio44> and for the event [11:29] <elchevive1968> jbrockmeier: something like....all the need/should be translated in one central location...and of course could be splited them in distro, manuals, man pages, how-tos, whatever... [11:29] <suseROCKs> I agree with having a "per country" point of contact, but not sure it should be a specific person. Either 2 or more people or a mailing address list that goes to all contact persons. [11:30] <elchevive1968> so the volunteers could choose what s/he would like to help translate [11:30] <-- davidx has left this channel ("Leaving"). [11:30] <alexio44> yaloki: nice idea :) [11:30] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: something like "utah@opensuse.org" [11:30] <suseROCKs> We all disappear from time to time and a whole country shouldn't at a loss due to the absence of one person.  :-) [11:30] <suseROCKs> jbrockmeier: yeah something like that would be good. [11:30] <yaloki> suseROCKs: it must be persons, but probably not just one [11:30] --> AlbertoP has joined this channel (n=AlbertoP@host73-69-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it). [11:30] <yaloki> ok, 1 for lichtenstein but.. [11:31] <jbrockmeier> elchevive1968: what's missing from this page? http://en.opensuse.org/Translation_Team [11:31] <suseROCKs> and they all get tied together at unitednations@opensuse.org  :-) [11:31] <yaloki> notlocalhorst: maybe it's the right spot to explain the problem you have with the promodvd requests [11:32] <jbrockmeier> I see a breakdown of things to be translated, and status, I think. [11:32] <notlocalhorst> it's a pita to send out 3000000 single packages, my spanish and russion sucks, it's expensive and a lot of work ... [11:32] <elchevive1968> jbrockmeier: this is the page for wiki translation... [11:32] <jbrockmeier> is it just we're not publicizing this well? [11:32] <jbrockmeier> elchevive1968: it has a status line for documentation, which points to: http://en.opensuse.org/Documentation [11:32] <notlocalhorst> i would like to have in every country someone who is taking care of stuff like this [11:33] <elchevive1968> jbrockmeier: so, we have one page for wiki, one for the distro, one for the manuals, etc... [11:33] * decriptor takes claim on utah@opensuse.org :P [11:33] <yaloki> *** hint: in 30min quite a lot of people will leave the meeting, so let's please try to focus and not only discuss SFD or the translations *** [11:33] <suseROCKs> if I'm not mistaken, of all the volunteer efforts, translation has GOT to be one of the most time-consuming. Maybe we should implement some sort of reward system for their efforts and time. [11:33] <jbrockmeier> thanks yaloki [11:33] <alexio44> notlocalhorst: that is beacuse EVERYBODY thinks that the promoDVD is equal to the SHIPIT of UBUNTU [11:33] <jbrockmeier> OK - let's move on and continue discussion about translations on -marketing, OK? [11:34] <yaloki> wait wait [11:34] <jbrockmeier> yaloki: make up your mind ;-) [11:34] <yaloki> I agree with notlocalhorst, that this would be a major step forward [11:34] <notlocalhorst> alexio44: not only that .. yes, sorting out all the single requests sucks, but there are also some requests which are hard to work on because of language skills or country knowledge [11:34] <yaloki> have _local_ opensuse.org promodvd/event/whatever contacts per country/region/language [11:34] <elchevive1968> ok [11:34] <alexio44> yaloki: nive [11:35] <notlocalhorst> one very good example, every tried to send a package to china? [11:35] <yaloki> e.g. everyone who wants to promote opensuse in, say, spain have one or two persons they can contact [11:35] <yaloki> those persons have regular contact with notlocalhorst [11:35] <yaloki> and can "bundle" requests to notlocalhorst, in english [11:35] <lejo> (put them on a map - like debian) [11:35] <yaloki> lejo: yeah, why not, that too [11:35] <suseROCKs> +1 [11:35] <alexio44> +1 [11:36] <jbrockmeier> notlocalhorst: you good with being the front person for the contacts? [11:36] <elchevive1968> +! [11:36] <jbrockmeier> (+1) [11:36] <rhorstkoetter> +1 [11:36] <michl> +1 [11:36] <notlocalhorst> sure, but let me thing about the details [11:36] <notlocalhorst> if more than 2 ppl are working together ist mostley a mess :-) [11:36] <notlocalhorst> so we need some infrastructure for it [11:36] <yaloki> need backups though [11:36] <jbrockmeier> notlocalhorst: can you put together a draft, we'll get the details ironed out in -marketing [11:36] <jbrockmeier> ? [11:37] --> federico1 has joined this channel (n=federico@opensuse/member/Federico-Mena). [11:37] <yaloki> jbrockmeier: +1 [11:37] <notlocalhorst> yes [11:37] <yaloki> brilliant, next topic ^^ [11:37] <FunkyPenguin> +1 [11:37] <alexio44> so .... we have acomplish transalation and local group marketing [11:37] <alexio44> next ;) [11:37] <jbrockmeier> OK, next topic [11:37] <jbrockmeier> Helping Hands [11:37] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: ? [11:38] <suseROCKs> hmm... I see Helping Hands as a huge topic and as yaloki said, many are leaving in about 30 minutes. [11:38] <yaloki> suseROCKs: it's simple :) [11:38] <suseROCKs> maybe we should let other topics get in first? [11:38] <yaloki> the idea is to expand HH to other areas, not just GNOME [11:38] <yaloki> so we need ideas, ideas, ideas [11:38] <Beineri> KDE ;-) [11:38] <yaloki> maybe organize polls [11:38] <suseROCKs> yaloki: yes but there's more to it. we need more volunteers (I'm pretty much the only one doing this now) [11:39] <suseROCKs> a place to host it [11:39] <decriptor> Beineri: are you volunteering to help with that :P [11:39] <yaloki> suseROCKs: first find topics then find the experts on the topic and ask them to do it [11:39] <suseROCKs> coordination of contacting people to present [11:39] <suseROCKs> and even changing the format of HH as well. [11:39] <rhorstkoetter> KDE4 would be interesting from my perspective [11:39] <Beineri> decriptor: well, there are not that many upstream KDE apps maintainer working for Novell as for GNOME... [11:39] <rhorstkoetter> not much people have experiences in KDE4 [11:40] <suseROCKs> It doesn't have to be Novell people. HH is not about promoting openSUSE/Novell. [11:40] <yaloki> once it's rolling, jbrockmeier could do (or help _us_ do) some noise about it in the press [11:40] <suseROCKs> It's about promoting all the things you can do on openSUSE. [11:40] <yaloki> suseROCKs: sort of. even if the topic isn't opensuse specific, it's an initiative of the community. it's an asset of the community. [11:40] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: how much prep time (approx.) does it take to get a HH ready? [11:41] <yaloki> other ideas: using rpm, rpm packaging intro, ... it's not just limited to desktops or desktop apps [11:41] <suseROCKs> the main prep time really is in finding someone to present. That sometimes can take weeks  :-) [11:41] <suseROCKs> exactly yaloki [11:41] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: right - it's about supporting our community, and attracting / keeping new users. [11:41] <suseROCKs> here's the other thing.... [11:41] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: but for a presenter? [11:41] <suseROCKs> When we launched HH, right after 11.0 release, we had good attendance. [11:42] <suseROCKs> Now, attendance is down a bit. And I think we need to start having more frequent events [11:42] <yaloki> and make even more noise about it [11:42] <suseROCKs> Like perhaps theme weeks. A week of presentations on graphics, or a week theme on packaging, etc. [11:43] <yaloki> suseROCKs: I think it's perfectly fine to have random topics every time [11:43] <suseROCKs> ok, let me ask a question which I ask frequently [11:43] <suseROCKs> Who would like to volunteer to work on this with me? [11:43] <AlbertoP> my two cents: not more than one event/week or you won't increase attendance if the schedule is too close. You risk to burn topics ;-) [11:43] <yaloki> AlbertoP: +1 [11:43] <yaloki> suseROCKs: explain what it means [11:44] <yaloki> - finding topics or find ways to collect ideas for topics [11:44] <jbrockmeier> AlbertoP: +1 [11:44] <yaloki> - contact potential presenters and ask them to do it [11:44] <suseROCKs> well, (and I've not actually gone over there to see) but doesn't ubuntu have some sort of 24/7 university thing going on? [11:44] <yaloki> - do the announcements [11:44] <yaloki> - be present to help a bit with moderation [11:44] <yaloki> suseROCKs: is that it ? :) [11:44] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: they do weeks - and we should consider something similar [11:45] <yaloki> yeah well we don't have the same crowd atm, so let's start "small", step by step IMO [11:45] <suseROCKs> the problem with weekly presentations is when you're interested in a particular topic and it isn't scheduled for many weeks and in the meantime you forget to go to HH events. [11:45] <jbrockmeier> but not necessarily HH - their weeks are very interactive, involve a lot of hand holding to get people involved in things like MOTU [11:45] <suseROCKs> Interest in learning about a distro is at a newbie's highest when they've just acquired the distro. [11:45] <jbrockmeier> yaloki: I agree - start with HH, but build up to a week event, preferably around 11.1 launch. [11:46] <yaloki> jbrockmeier: good idea, for the 11.1 launch [11:46] <yaloki> suseROCKs: yup [11:46] <suseROCKs> jbrockmeier: right. I'm looking at this as a learning experience in preparation for 11.1, we have the opportunity now to learn from what worked and what didn't and tinker around a bit [11:46] <yaloki> ok, who wants to help suseROCKs organize the HH sessions ? [11:47] <suseROCKs> see? always silence!  :-) [11:47] <yaloki> (if no one wants to, let's push it to the mailing-list, blog about it, make a broader call for volunteers) [11:47] <-> rhorstkoetter> any chance you can assist? [11:47] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: give people a second :-) [11:47] <ccoray> HH == Helping Hands? [11:47] <yaloki> ccoray: yes [11:47] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: not everyone is a fast typist. [11:48] <suseROCKs> as a teaser to potential volunteers: There is one nice benefit to being a volunteer coordinator... It is an excellent way of networking with the open source community since you need to contact presenters from various projects. [11:48] <yaloki> *** 20min before end *** [11:48] <ccoray> Yeah, some of us are trying to work during this.. ;) I don't know much about HH, but I can give it a shot [11:48] <ccoray> I'm real good at calling/e-mailing people [11:49] <yaloki> and if you need contacts, information about who is an expert about what, etc... you can always contact jbrockmeier, the board, etc... [11:49] <suseROCKs> ccoray is now being drafted/volunteered... [11:49] <yaloki> don't be afraid of poking people [11:49] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: looks like at least one volunteer. Can you put out a call on the -marketing list, blog about it? [11:49] <suseROCKs> sure [11:49] <jbrockmeier> Shall we move on? [11:49] <jbrockmeier> Next topic: openSUSE TV [11:49] <yaloki> suseROCKs: just make sure to precisely explain what the "task" is [11:49] <suseROCKs> yes sir [11:50] --> davidx has joined this channel (n=david@pdpc/supporter/active/davidx). [11:50] <FunkyPenguin> ok, briefly openSUSE TV is a medium to get the message about openSUSE out to the wider world [11:51] <FunkyPenguin> it isn't necessarily aimed at experienced users, but at users on other OSes looking at linux [11:51] <suseROCKs> with screencasts as the primary method? [11:52] <FunkyPenguin> doesnt have to be screencasts, it can be presentations [11:52] <jbrockmeier> FunkyPenguin: do you have any so far to point people at? [11:52] <FunkyPenguin> the bulk of the content is actually talks/presentations [11:53] <FunkyPenguin> for those that want to watch any of the content head over to http://opensuse.blip.tv [11:53] <suseROCKs> If I can make a suggestion.... [11:53] <FunkyPenguin> yes the primary way of viewing video is via flash [11:53] <ccoray> .flv? [11:54] <jbrockmeier> suseROCKs: ? [11:54] <FunkyPenguin> but you can view it in multiple formats, currently flash/whatever the original source was/m4v (for ipods) [11:54] <suseROCKs> since it has the same goals as HH, how about putting together a list of suggested topics for screencasts/presentations and then putting out a call for volunteers to "check out" a topic to submit to oS-TV [11:54] <-- }-Tux-{ has left this server ("kampf-chameleon"). [11:54] <suseROCKs> has the advantage of inspiring ideas to contributors, and speeding up content buildup. [11:54] <FunkyPenguin> definatley [11:54] <ccoray> suseROCKs: I like that [11:54] <jbrockmeier> FunkyPenguin: the two projects do seem awfully close [11:55] <notlocalhorst> wait until you see the videos of todays party, thats not helping anybody ... :-) [11:55] <suseROCKs> Oh there is definitely going to be (and in some cases, intended) overlaps between HH, oS-TV and openSUSE-Tutorials [11:55] <yaloki> not necessarily [11:55] <yaloki> there are lots of videos from talks at conferences [11:55] <FunkyPenguin> jbrockmeier: they are, but at the same time they aren't [11:56] <suseROCKs> I think its great that there are some similarities. We're ready on any possible front that a new user might approach first.  :-) [11:57] <FunkyPenguin> some people have issue with the fact that it uses proprietary codecs etc, and as such I plan on working closely with digitltom to ensure that tube.o.o which is exclusively in .ogg to ensure that users can view all the content in whatever format they wish [11:57] <ccoray> suseROCKs: So maybe not combining projects but definitely collaboration [11:58] <suseROCKs> I'm not familiar with video formats in general. but is .ogg viewable out of box on Windows? We're attracting new users after all... [11:58] <suseROCKs> ccoray: definitely there's collaboration going on  :-) [11:58] <rhorstkoetter> suseROCKs: it is not [11:58] <ccoray> suseROCKs: I believe so. [11:58] <suseROCKs> <-- is an editor with openSUSE-Tutorials [11:58] <ccoray> no? [11:58] <rhorstkoetter> no [11:59] * alexio44 is learning inskape .... :) [11:59] <rhorstkoetter> no vorbis by default in windows [11:59] <suseROCKs> well then that would be a problem if we're trying to attract new users on the other turf. [11:59] <rhorstkoetter> definitely [11:59] <yaloki> ok. any TODOs, any painpoints, any calling for help ? or next topic? [11:59] <jbrockmeier> unfortunately, I think .ogg is as difficult for Windows users as .mov or whatever is for Linux users. [11:59] <rhorstkoetter> right now, it's in flash? [11:59] <yaloki> rhorstkoetter: yes + links to vorbis that's hosted on tube.o.o [12:00] <yaloki> s/vorbis/theora/ sorry [12:00] <jbrockmeier> can we hold the codec discussion for the mailing list? [12:00] <FunkyPenguin> rhorstkoetter: there are only a few videos atm that aren't on tube [12:00] <jbrockmeier> we definitely won't solve that here. [12:00] <FunkyPenguin> heh, sure [12:00] <suseROCKs> yes +1 jbrockmeier [12:00] <alexio44> yes .... it is flash [12:00] <jbrockmeier> yaloki: you have time to give us your suggestion/topic? [12:00] <yaloki> yeah [12:00] <rhorstkoetter> hm, flash isn't that painful for both win/lin users. is it? [12:00] <yaloki> well it's something we brainstormed this afternoon at hack^Wmeetweek [12:01] <yaloki> one issue is to attract software developers to the opensuse community [12:01] <yaloki> also in order to develop our own infrastructure of services [12:01] <yaloki> (OBS, software portal, users.o.o, whatnot) [12:01] <yaloki> we should do a marketing campaign that is specifically targetting software developers [12:01] <yaloki> many, e.g. PHP, Rails, Java, etc... developers use windows or macosx [12:02] <yaloki> hence show how easy it is to configure apache with php with yast, how easy it is to install the latest version of grails and ruby gems, etc... [12:02] <yaloki> try to market openSUSE as being the best option for software developers (if they pick linux) [12:02] <yaloki> currently lots of java devs use ubuntu, because it's the "hype" (and linux == ubuntu, right ?) [12:03] <yaloki> other TODOs include have good support of packages of eclipse, openjdk, django (python), etc.. on openSUSE [12:03] <suseROCKs> its true that we do need to counter some of the ubuntu hype [12:03] <yaloki> actually, NO linux distribution is doing that atm [12:03] <yaloki> at least AFAIK [12:03] <yaloki> (having a marketing campaign that's specifically targetted at software developers) [12:03] <suseROCKs> so how do you target developers? [12:03] <yaloki> so.. we might get an edge here [12:03] <jbrockmeier> yaloki: generally, when I'm at a show like OSCON [12:03] <FunkyPenguin> the only dev field where openSUSE wins is in Mono [12:03] <jbrockmeier> what I see is miles of MacBooks [12:03] <yaloki> yeah [12:04] <jbrockmeier> so, yaloki - we really ought to be targeting Mac OS X, yeah? [12:04] <yaloki> e.g. vmware images of opensuse with eclipse, tomcat, jboss, etc... [12:04] <jbrockmeier> I mean, if you're looking at Web devs. [12:04] <yaloki> well, everything [12:04] <jbrockmeier> (Java, PHP, Rails, etc.) [12:04] <yaloki> the goal isn't to sell more openSUSE [12:05] <yaloki> the goal is to get developers to use openSUSE [12:05] <yaloki> and then get them to participate in software development projects on openSUSE [12:05] <suseROCKs> From my experience working in a design shop, web devs are not particularly operating system intuitive. That's a challenge here. [12:05] <yaloki> (OBS, software portal, users.o.o, etc.....) [12:05] <notlocalhorst> don't be fixed on webdevs, could be everything ... [12:06] <yaloki> suseROCKs: well no, we already have great tools, great packages, yast is awesome. but they don't know. it's not presented to them because everything that is showing off openSUSE is not targetting software devs [12:06] <suseROCKs> what I do recall was that the tools, apache, tomcat, etc. were harder to configure on oSX, so we should focus on why it is easier and more plugins available, etc. in openSUSE. [12:06] <yaloki> ok, that's pretty much the idea. there are a few details we already talked about at hackweek, let's discuss the details on the mailing-list in the next days [12:06] <ccoray> ((brb)) [12:06] <yaloki> *** 1 min before BBQ in NUE *** ;)) [12:06] <-- ccoray has left this server ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0.1/2008070208]"). [12:06] <yaloki> suseROCKs: exactly [12:07] <jbrockmeier> OK - we're past the 1 hr mark - still have a few topics. [12:07] <jbrockmeier> FunkyPenguin: are you able to stay, or do you have to take off? [12:07] <suseROCKs> yaloki: so we need, before going forth on that marketing scheme, is someone who can expertly map out the differences/advantages to running the same tools on oS. [12:07] <notlocalhorst> we have to go now ... [12:07] <yaloki> suseROCKs: easy [12:07] <suseROCKs> yaloki just volunteered... [12:07] <yaloki> suseROCKs: we have a few ideas already, let's get into the details on the -marketing@ list [12:08] <yaloki> suseROCKs: yup [12:08] <suseROCKs> therefore I +1 yaloki's idea. [12:08] <-- cyberorg has left this server (Remote closed the connection). [12:08] <jbrockmeier> OK - we still need to talk about opensuse-tutorials and podcasts. [12:08] <yaloki> oh, good you mention that [12:08] <jbrockmeier> do others have time for those, or do we need to carry to the list? [12:08] <yaloki> how about opensuse-tutorials.com => tutorials.opensuse-community.org ? [12:08] <yaloki> (just the domain name) [12:09] * yaloki has to leave too [12:09] <jbrockmeier> yaloki: you mean point to? [12:09] <yaloki> jbrockmeier: the .com is just.. a bit.. strange :) [12:09] <FunkyPenguin> jbrockmeier: ideally head off [12:09] <Beineri> any benefit doing that? [12:09] <yaloki> (IMHO :)) [12:09] <-- notlocalhorst has left this server ("Kopete 0.11.1 : http://kopete.kde.org"). [12:09] * FunkyPenguin has no pass to get out of the building [12:09] <suseROCKs> we can change to .org easily enough, that's not difficult [12:09] <jbrockmeier> OK - we're losing several folks [12:09] <jbrockmeier> so let's discuss the other two on the list [12:10] <-- HolgiDE has left this server ("Bye all"). [12:10] <jbrockmeier> and meet again in 2 weeks [12:10] <jbrockmeier> OK? [12:10] <jbrockmeier> any objections? [12:10] <suseROCKs> yeah decriptor where are you? [12:10] <alexio44> +1 [12:10] <alexio44> one hour meeting ;) [12:10] <jbrockmeier> thanks to everyone for attending. [12:10] <suseROCKs> thanks to you all as well...