openSUSE:Testing meeting 20100621
tagline: From openSUSE
- Channel Operators for #opensuse-testing
- TCT wiki page
(18:59:03) bmwiedemann: got home just in time. 1 minute to meeting :) (18:59:35) Holgi: same here ;-) (19:00:08) bmwiedemann: so welcome ladies (do we have any around) and gentlemen (19:00:16) bmwiedemann: to todays testing core team meeting (19:00:21) LWFinger: Hi. (19:01:22) bmwiedemann: topics are on http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_Testing_Core_Team/Meetings (19:01:32) bmwiedemann: first one is "own experience of openSUSE 11.3 RC1" (19:02:22) bmwiedemann: my impression is that it did smooth out some things, but missed a few others (e.g. the hal and LVM) (19:03:36) bmwiedemann: possible because earlier milestones were rather poor on installability/testability (19:03:55) Holgi: I'm working on RC1 and it is possible (19:04:01) Holgi: but there are some issues (19:04:06) badshah [~email@example.com] hat den Raum betreten. (19:04:09) Holgi: e.a. wacom input (19:04:11) FunkyPenguin hat den Raum verlassen (quit: Quit: Leaving). (19:04:32) badshah: Has the meeting started? (19:04:34) bmwiedemann: I upgraded my netbook (eeepc 900A) to RC1 via zypper dup yesterday. it does work (19:04:54) bmwiedemann: hi badshah: we are still at the first topic of http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_Testing_Core_Team/Meetings (19:05:01) Holgi: badshah: yes, but just 2 min ago (19:05:01) badshah: Thanks (19:05:29) badshah: ok. sorry for missing previous 3 meetings, as I had to be away due to work (19:05:51) LWFinger: I have 3 installations of RC1 - 1 64-bit "zypper dup", 1 32-bit VM "zypper dup" , and a new 32-bit KDE install from Live CD. (19:06:17) Holgi: badshah: sure, work has first priority (19:06:42) badshah: I did Live-CD installations from the GNOME and KDE Live-CD's with 64-bit architecture (19:06:49) LWFinger: The two zypper dup systems are fine, but a few problems with new install. (19:07:36) badshah: Installation went well, then found some application bugs in GNOME and reported them in bugzilla (19:07:59) LWFinger: Firstly, the NET install disk froze at the starting udev phase. Second problem - one that was supposed to have been fixed after M& is still there. (19:08:11) LWFinger: s/&/7/ (19:09:00) bmwiedemann: LWFinger: which bug id? could add regression tests for it (19:09:13) LWFinger: When you try to set up an NFS client, the host directory is not created, and fstab is not updated. (19:10:52) LWFinger: I'm trying to find the number, but the bugzilla link looks borked. (19:11:51) badshah: I found some bugs testing the Gnome desktop --- hibernation related: bug 615646 (19:12:24) badshah: and splashy related: bug 615318 (19:16:02) Holgi: anything more? (19:16:17) bmwiedemann: I saw 3 of 4 of the most annoying bugs are marked fixed. I verified the hal one already. with all the other issues, there appears to be some more work needed to a good 11.3 release. (19:17:31) badshah: GIMP splash-screen was left unbranded too (19:17:42) badshah: i mean it still has the 11.2 branding (19:18:04) bmwiedemann: badshah: I saw a report to that. and I think it was worked on. (19:18:38) badshah: Yes, should be fixed now in factory (19:18:58) badshah: i met a critical bug that I have no idea on how to reproduce: bug 615649 (19:19:51) LWFinger: I found mine: Bug 608166 (19:22:23) badshah: I raised this usability related issue with YaST's package manager: bug 613822 (19:23:01) bmwiedemann: right. coders can forget about usability just too easily. (19:24:52) badshah: bmwiedemann: yes, that is true; in this case though the options themselves were introduced very late into the release cycle and so I could only spot the issue just in the pre-RC phase (19:25:02) badshah: btw, that bug is here https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=613822 (19:26:11) Holgi hat den Raum verlassen (quit: Ping timeout: 248 seconds). (19:26:51) LWFinger: Wireless seems pretty good in RC1. There are complaints in the Forum, but mostly using wierd drivers. (19:28:05) bmwiedemann: LWFinger: I still have a problem with my ath5k on eeepc 900a. https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=595586 (19:28:30) badshah: One issue that has persisted since M6 is a problem while trying to install from the Gnome Live-CD (19:28:31) badshah: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=602760 (19:28:39) Holgi [~firstname.lastname@example.org] hat den Raum betreten. (19:28:55) Holgi: sorry, my connection froze (19:29:04) Holgi: what did I miss? (19:29:39) bmwiedemann: Holgi: some more bugs 615649 608166 613822 602760 (19:29:45) Holgi: ok (19:30:18) LWFinger: bmwiedemann: I'll have to review that one. Most problems with rfkill have been sorted out, but some Netbooks have problems. (19:33:38) Holgi heißt jetzt HolgiDE (19:34:02) bmwiedemann: let us finish with this topic (19:34:05) HolgiDE hat den Raum verlassen (quit: Changing host). (19:34:05) HolgiDE [~holger@CAcert/Assurer/HolgiDE] hat den Raum betreten. (19:34:05) #opensuse-testing: Modus (+o HolgiDE) von ChanServ (19:34:26) bmwiedemann: I was wondering if we should test factory before RC2 (19:34:47) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: aren't you doing that anyway? (19:34:53) LWFinger: I think so, but when? (19:35:07) badshah: bmwiedemann: yes that will be good (19:35:12) bmwiedemann: HolgiDE: only the automagic testing, but this will miss a lot of stuff (19:36:22) LWFinger: I'm concerned about the bugs that are supposedly fixed, but never make it to the next step! (19:36:22) badshah: the main point is to know when to test, because factory is very fluid at this point (19:36:37) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: my suggestion is: let's monitor our bug and if fixed retest them (19:36:42) bmwiedemann: LWFinger: RC2 is due 2010-07-01 so updating this week seems good (19:36:43) HolgiDE: bugs (19:37:09) bmwiedemann: and set status to "VERIFIED" if it is really gone in factory? (19:37:29) LWFinger: Good idea. (19:37:30) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: yes, if they are fixed (19:38:21) HolgiDE: for my understanding for rc2 there should just bugfixed been submitted (19:38:44) HolgiDE: bugfixes (19:39:13) bmwiedemann: so it is rather unlikely that factory really breaks something. but if it would, we need to spot it (19:39:21) badshah: HolgiDE: whole KDE stack being upgraded to 4.4.4 from 4.4.3 (19:40:55) bmwiedemann: badshah: maybe also counts as bugfix like linux 2.6.34.x++ updates? (19:41:48) HolgiDE: badshah: that's just the version number changing (19:41:48) badshah: yes, but also has the potential for introducing problems, i guess (19:42:01) HolgiDE: badshah: patches have already been in (19:42:14) LWFinger: I think it will. (19:42:51) badshah: HolgiDE: I thought there were several more changes to go in with this version bump, but I may be wrong (19:43:44) bmwiedemann: next topic on todays list would be "Channel Operators for #opensuse-testing" (19:43:51) HolgiDE: badshah: I don't have details also, but above is what I heard (19:45:22) badshah: Anyways, we should do more careful tests with the new kde stack then (19:45:40) bmwiedemann: OK (19:45:46) HolgiDE: badshah: right (19:46:46) LWFinger: I see that HolgiDE has channel operator privileges. (19:47:00) HolgiDE: LWFinger: pst, that's next topic (19:47:08) badshah: generally, if any of you have been using Gnome from the factory, what is your opinion of turning on tracker [replacement] by default? (19:47:18) bmwiedemann: yes. next topic, please. (19:47:34) badshah: i mean tracker as the replacement of beagle (19:47:48) bmwiedemann: sorry badshah, can we discuss that later (I have not been using gnome actively) (19:48:18) badshah: bmwiedemann: sure, ok nxt topic then (19:48:32) bmwiedemann: that is IRC ops (19:48:44) bmwiedemann: what would be the task of an IRC op? (19:49:19) HolgiDE: topic #2: Channel Operators for #opensuse-testing (19:49:46) HolgiDE: we now do have channel operator status back for our channel (19:49:55) HolgiDE: darix gave me channel operator rights (19:50:09) HolgiDE: so if we get into trouble we can kick people out (19:50:21) HolgiDE: if there is the need to get more channel operators (19:50:30) HolgiDE: we have to negotiate with darix (19:50:45) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: irc op != channel op (19:51:12) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: irc op has rights for the whole network (19:51:28) bmwiedemann: ah. OK. so if someone flooded the channel or was otherwise nasty, this would be the job of the channel op, right? (19:51:36) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: channel op can set topic, kick people, moderate a channel if necessary ... (19:51:44) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: right (19:53:00) LWFinger: I'm satisfied with Holgi in that role. If we need another, we could always get one - right? (19:53:13) HolgiDE: LWFinger: yes (19:53:30) HolgiDE: any more questions? (19:53:41) badshah: None from me (19:53:41) LWFinger: No. (19:53:49) HolgiDE: ok, than we can move over (19:54:19) bmwiedemann: third topic for today is "TCT wiki page" (19:54:27) HolgiDE: right (19:54:47) HolgiDE: from my point of view test core team (tct) meeting page is somehow outdated (19:54:55) badshah: This concerns the new wiki instance or the old one? (19:55:05) HolgiDE: same for http://en.opensuse.org/Testing (19:55:20) HolgiDE: maybe we can "take over" http://en.opensuse.org/Testing (19:55:28) HolgiDE: and update both pages (19:55:43) badshah: HolgiDE: we have to start migrating to wiki.opensuse.org anyway, right so why not do it now? (19:55:53) HolgiDE: since a lot of people from http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_Testing_Core_Team are no longer active (19:56:01) HolgiDE: it does not make sense to mention them there (19:56:31) HolgiDE: badshah: that's right, would be a very good reason to change (19:57:33) bmwiedemann: also the wiki should be corrected. "TCT is in charge of testing the openSUSE distro" would be bad... we want others to be testers as well. (19:57:49) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: correct (19:57:52) badshah: I could take up this work of migrating the necessary pages to the new wiki and updating our pages in the process as well (19:58:00) HolgiDE: are there any volunteer for that? (19:58:50) HolgiDE: 3, 2, 1 - no sold (19:58:55) bmwiedemann: I can do the rewording. how about "TCT coordinates the testing of .." (19:59:06) badshah: I volunteered in the above line itself :) (19:59:19) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: quite better (19:59:27) HolgiDE: badshah: good (20:00:04) badshah: OK then, I will first update pages in the current wiki, and then set up a testing portal in the new wiki (20:00:16) HolgiDE: badshah: very good (20:00:36) badshah: then we can look into what pages from the old wiki we want to keep for the new one; dos this seem okay? (20:00:39) HolgiDE: from my point of view "Testing" page should be the landing page (20:00:50) HolgiDE: and contain important information (20:00:55) HolgiDE: about testing (20:01:11) HolgiDE: any other thoughts? (20:01:13) bmwiedemann: I agree (20:01:28) LWFinger: Looks good to me. (20:01:49) badshah: OK (20:02:46) HolgiDE: good (20:03:30) badshah: the new wiki instance does look quite overwhelming to me yet, but I will give it a try anyways (20:03:36) bmwiedemann: part of the page is already good for landing. But the Test Plan part would need some introductory sentence (20:04:04) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: testplans are quite outdated (20:04:31) k0da [~k0da@opensuse/member/k0da] hat den Raum betreten. (20:04:34) LWFinger: Let us know by email when you want us to look and comment. (20:05:56) HolgiDE: badshah: or tell where you need help (20:06:18) bmwiedemann: so badshah does the wiki cleanup / transition. (20:06:28) HolgiDE: LWFinger: is good in writing our weekly news (20:06:29) badshah: OK, will let you know when I need help (20:06:47) HolgiDE: LWFinger: so can support you (20:08:15) HolgiDE: ok, then we are done with this topic (20:08:20) badshah: OK, thanks I will get in touch when I need help (20:08:26) LWFinger: I missed a couple of weeks - one offline and no news the other. Any suggestions would be welcome. (20:08:57) HolgiDE: please everybody support LWFinger ! (20:10:30) badshah: I guess a summary of the meeting, and pointing out the bugs discussed by the TCT team would be good for the news? (20:10:41) bmwiedemann: Having the same news every week like "we want you for testing" would probably not count as news. it certainly would bore me if I had to read it. but we might use something catchy/recognisable at the end of report. (20:11:38) bmwiedemann: badshah: yes, sounds good. shows that we do our part. (20:12:03) LWFinger: After a meeting, news is not a problem. It is in between releases that is the problem. (20:12:35) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: I'm sure LWFinger is happy for every other input (20:12:40) bmwiedemann: we could do another meeting next Monday to discuss factory (20:12:40) badshah: LWFinger: I thought as much (20:12:58) badshah: bmwiedemann: sounds good to me (20:13:09) HolgiDE: Thu, Jul 01, openSUSE 11.3 RC 2 release, so next meeting at July, 5th (20:13:42) LWFinger: OK with me to discuss Factory next week. What day/time should we pull? (20:13:58) bmwiedemann: HolgiDE: one on 2010-06-28 and one on 2010-07-05 (would nearly be too late for GM) (20:13:59) badshah: we could check-out factory iso's on Thursday and discuss it on Monday? (20:14:30) bmwiedemann: I will probably do another zypper dup later this week (20:14:36) HolgiDE: badshah: sure, if all are open for that (20:14:39) LWFinger: OK - Thursday at 17:00 UTC sounds good. (20:15:11) HolgiDE: now we have two dates: (20:15:17) badshah: LWFinger: You mean about the factory downloading right? (20:15:28) HolgiDE: thuesday & monday (20:16:10) LWFinger: badshah: Yes. (20:16:11) bmwiedemann: HolgiDE: thursday or tuesday? (20:16:59) badshah: So let us just see if everyone present agrees with a Monday 06/28 meeting (20:17:09) LWFinger: I do. (20:17:10) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: does not matter, we just need one date (20:17:13) badshah: 1700 UTC? (20:17:38) bmwiedemann: 2010-06-28 17:00 UTC sounds good. (20:17:50) HolgiDE: ok (20:18:42) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: can you post the log from today? I don't have the full due to disconnect (20:19:43) bmwiedemann: sure (20:20:03) HolgiDE: bmwiedemann: thanks (20:20:08) LWFinger: See you next week.