Meetings/Status Meeting 2007-05-23/transcript

From openSUSE

18:00 <adrianS>	Welcome to the openSUSE status meeting
18:00 <adrianS>	Martin and Henne are not available today, so I will take over for today
18:01 <adrianS>	we have the standard status points
18:01 <adrianS>	1. distribution
18:01 <adrianS>	2. communication
18:01 <adrianS>	3. build service
18:01 <adrianS>	additionally we would like to talk about the "guiding principles" proposal shortly
18:01 <adrianS>	1. distribution
18:02 <adrianS>	AJ is also unavailable, so he would say that 10.3 Alpha 4 got released as you noticed ;)
18:02 <adrianS>	we broke Factory with freetype2 and fixed it again
18:02 <adrianS>	next big steps are gcc 4.2 and glibc 2.6 updates
18:03 <adrianS>	we do also verify packages with rpmlint internally and we will add this also in the build service
18:03 <adrianS>	does anyone have questions regarding the distro ?
18:03 <adrianS>	...
18:04 <adrianS>	okay, I move on ....
18:04 <adrianS>	2. Communication
18:04 <apokryphos>	what's the status going to be of instlux? Is it going to be supported by the team, or just something extra around?
18:04 <adrianS>	My understanding was that it should become part of the distro
18:04 <apokryphos>	I think the project is nice and great, but will it be in releasable shape in time? A lot of sites were quite negative about it
18:04 <Beineri>	because?
18:05 <apokryphos>	it didn't work
18:05 <adrianS>	AJ was unfortunatly on vacation last week and very busy this week, so he didn't manage to answer on the ml
18:05 <adrianS>	apokryphos: well, we can handle this via bugzilla ...
18:05 <Beineri>	apokryphos: hasn't the inclusion into an Alpha the goal to find those bugs? :-)
18:05 <adrianS>	if there are too many problems after beta 1 we can remove it again
18:05 <adrianS>	it is an optional addon, so it can't break anything
18:06 <adrianS>	I hope :)
18:06 <apokryphos>	Beineri: I'd love to see it included if it works; I just fear the bad comments if it doesn't 8) (people should have nothing bad to say about 10.3 :P)
18:06 <apokryphos>	but that's cool, I'll try to help and test too :)
18:06 <apokryphos>	adrianS: sounds good
18:07 <adrianS>	okay, lets move on
18:07 <adrianS>	2. Communication
18:07 <adrianS>	We will be on LinuxTag in Berlin next week as announced before
18:07 <adrianS>	with own track and own booth
18:08 <adrianS>	plenty of SUSE people will be there so, we would be happy to see anyone from you :)
18:08 <adrianS>	LWE in San Francisco planning has also started, we will have a booth there
18:09 <adrianS>	We do definitly look for community members to be on the booth as well
18:09 <adrianS>	on LinuxTag and LWE
18:09 <adrianS>	Additionally we will have a presence at aKademy and Guadec
18:09 <adrianS>	Is anyone interessted to join ?
18:10 <metavoid>	sorry, I'm late... a question regarding disro: what is the status of networking? I was told that ifplug tools and smppd are not supported already, how soon they will be dropped?
18:10 <metavoid>	a link: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=275324#c1
18:10 <bugbot>	openSUSE bug 275324 in openSUSE 10.3 (Network) "smpppd to be able to connect by domain name" [Enhancement,Resolved: wontfix]
18:10 	 * cboltz will come to the LinuxTag (and also help at the booth ;-)
18:10 <adrianS>	metavoid: sorry, I dunno, please ask on opensuse-factory
18:10 <adrianS>	cboltz: great :)
18:10 <notlocalhorst>	cboltz: which day?
18:11 <cboltz>	good question, probably the first 3 days
18:11 <notlocalhorst>	cool
18:11 	 * adrianS doesn't saw notlocalhorst
18:11 <drdavis_>	Just a quick plug.  The Linux Foundation is meeting early in June and several Novell/SUSE people will be there as well.
18:11 <notlocalhorst>	it's ok, network is not good here ...
18:12 <adrianS>	okay, let's move on to the build service ...
18:12 <notlocalhorst>	one last thing
18:12 <notlocalhorst>	- guiding principles are online
18:12 <adrianS>	extra point ;)
18:12 <notlocalhorst>	ah ok
18:12 <adrianS>	regarding the build service
18:12 <cboltz>	wait, I have something for communication
18:13 <cboltz>	Do we need an opensuse-offtopic mailinglist? (see discussions in opensuse-project from the last days)
18:13 <sjones>	cb400f, We already have one.
18:13 <sjones>	sorry
18:13 <adrianS>	cboltz: we can create one, but I doubt that it will help opensuse@ a lot ...
18:14 <sjones>	There's already an -offtopic list.  Nobody seems to be able to direct ot posts to it, though.
18:14 <cboltz>	There are already people that *know* that -project istn't the correct list for their topic, so there's still hope ;-)
18:14 <cboltz>	sjones: where's this list? I can't find it in the archives...
18:14 <Beineri>	opensuse-offtopic feels more like a daily-microsoft-press-review list
18:14 <sjones>	It's not archived
18:15 <adrianS>	k, let's move on, okay ?
18:15 <adrianS>	The good thing is that we might have fixed the final problem with the build enviroment setup problems
18:15 <Beineri>	no conclusion? :-)
18:16 <adrianS>	The bad thing is that we do not know, because we broke Factory at the same time, so we dunno if that hides problems
18:16 <cboltz>	I still would be interested in where this ominous ;-) OT-list is...
18:16 <Beineri>	cboltz: mailto:opensuse-offtopic-subscribe@opensuse.org
18:16 <adrianS>	okay, shall we make the -offtopic list as archive ?
18:17 <adrianS>	so it gets listed on lists.opensuse.org ?
18:17 <Beineri>	and shall we list it on Communicate wiki page?
18:17 <cboltz>	Communicate page is a good idea
18:17 <adrianS>	Beineri: good idea, that is definitive the first step
18:17 <adrianS>	Beineri: can you do it ?
18:17 <Beineri>	imo it's really not worth archiving
18:18 	 * Beineri can
18:18 <adrianS>	okay, let's try that first ...
18:18 <sjones>	Beineri, That's why ckm never had it archived originally.
18:19 <adrianS>	okay, topic closed ?
18:20 <cboltz>	yes
18:20 <adrianS>	just to refrase the build service topics
18:20 <adrianS>	The good thing is that we might have fixed the final problem with the build enviroment setup problems
18:20 <adrianS>	The bad thing is that we do not know, because we broke Factory at the same time, so we dunno if that hides problems
18:20 <adrianS>	beside that mls is still working on boot strap functionality
18:20 <adrianS>	Andreas is working on ruby/rails version upgrade
18:21 <adrianS>	he has some trouble there with new bugs
18:21 <adrianS>	any questions regarding the build service ?
18:21 <adrianS>	ah, we will know for sure about the state next week, after next Factory import
18:22 <apokryphos>	I was thinking, once factory goes to the OBS, it will be theoretically possible for people from the community to contribute directly to factory, right?
18:22 <adrianS>	right
18:22 <apokryphos>	great :)
18:23 <adrianS>	k ... last BIG point, cornelius has announced the guiding principles and maintains a locked page based on the discussions in opensuse-project ml
18:23 <adrianS>	http://en.opensuse.org/Guiding_Principles
18:23 <adrianS>	cornelius: do you want to say something about that ?
18:24 <cornelius>	As I said it on the opensuse-project mailing list, we welcome feedback.
18:24 <cornelius>	It's meant as a draft and we would like to come to a commonly accepted version.
18:25 <cornelius>	Hopefully this can solve some of the problems which arise because of unclear expectations about the project.
18:25 <cornelius>	How is the feeling? Does the document make sense?
18:26 <apokryphos>	I like the general approach (as I said on the list)
18:27 <apokryphos>	one point benJIman raised earlier was about the "best Linux distribution" language; I think this implicitly implies that other Linux distributiosn are the competition. Should it say "best operation system"?
18:28 <Eelis>	*operating
18:28 <madferret>	its nice, and I think the board of governance will cause frisson
18:28 <apokryphos>	Eelis: indeed :)
18:29 <Beineri>	madferret: frisson?
18:29 <madferret>	still competitors...
18:29 <adrianS>	who ?
18:29 <Beineri>	because of fear or joy?
18:29 <sjones>	Beineri, friction, perhaps.
18:29 <cornelius>	"best operating system" would be more vague. It could also imply that openSUSE could move to a non-Linux kernel at some time. Is this what we want to imply?
18:30 <Beineri>	sjones: I think the board's task is to reduce friction - not to cause it :-)
18:31 <madferret>	Beineri: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/frisson
18:31 <sjones>	Beineri, I already see it starting, and there have only been 6 replies to the announcement.
18:31 <madferret>	and friction
18:31 <apokryphos>	cornelius: hm, very true
18:31 <sjones>	Beineri, More specifically, the first message to respond to the idea of a board.
18:32 <Beineri>	sjones: still not sure if it's meant positive or negative way :-)
18:34 <sjones>	Beineri, In this case, negative.  M Harris is already getting out a bucket of sand to throw in the gears.
18:36 <Beineri>	cornelius: is there any roadmap how to proceed with the guiding principles? deadline for next draft/final version?
18:36 <madferret>	sjones: he is already hijacking the thread
18:36 <madferret>	amazing, he is fast
18:37 <benJIman>	Has the meeting ended or just fizzled out?
18:37 	 * Beineri rings the bell to wake everyone up again
18:37 <cornelius>	Beineri: I think it makes most sense to make this dependent on the discussion. So no fixed deadline.
18:38 <adrianS>	we have just one more topic, the QA session, and the only question there has been answered already
18:38 <benJIman>	cornelius: "best linux distribution" could still be less good than windows and macos for example.
18:38 <adrianS>	so we can simply spend some more time on the guiding principles
18:38 <Beineri>	then "questions from the channel"?
18:38 <benJIman>	cornelius: and of course there is the possibility of other kernels
18:39 <cornelius>	benJIman: you are of course right that we want to be better than windows.
18:39 <adrianS>	Beineri: the guiding principles are the most important topic IMHO, let's close the meeting officially, but keep the discussion on the guiding principles, if no one disagrees
18:39 <Uranellus>	there are still differences between opensuse 10.2 installer and sles installer. will those features in sles' installer get into opensuse?
18:40 <drdavis_>	I was just curious if any openSUSE people were going to be at the Linux Foundation Summit? ( http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/Agenda_and_Schedule )
18:40 <cornelius>	benJIman: on the other hand I'm not sure, if we really want to talk about competition in the guiding principles.
18:40 <cornelius>	benJIman: and my feeling would be that Linux really is a core value of openSUSE, but maybe I'm wrong.
18:40 <madferret>	cornelius: the old of saying "most usable linux distro" or soemthing sounds more neutral
18:40 <Beineri>	Uranellus: like? no desktop selection screen!? :-)
18:41 <Uranellus>	Beineri: in post install setup you could let sles' set up a openldap server automatically.
18:41 <Eelis>	good to hear gcc 4.2 is being incorporated. thanks!
18:42 <benJIman>	Uranellus: there is an ldap server yast module you can use later.
18:42 <Beineri>	adrianS: just say when I shall stop logging ;-), and when the next meeting will be
18:42 <adrianS>	okay, the meeting is closed officially, have a nice day
18:42 <adrianS>	The next meeting will be in two weeks as usual
18:42 <adrianS>	same time, same place