Meetings/Status Meeting 2006-11-22/transcript

From openSUSE

00 @<henne> Welcome to the openSUSE Status Meeting!
18:01 @<henne> shut your piehole now :)
18:01 @<henne> This meeting is meant to discuss the latest developments in and around openSUSE.
18:01 @<henne> The topics of this meeting are:
18:01 @<henne> * Status 10.2
18:01 @<henne> * Status wiki
18:01 @<henne> * Status build service
18:01 @<henne> * Q/A session
18:01 @<henne> lets go. AJaeger please
18:01  <AJaeger> WElcome everybody!
18:02  <AJaeger> openSUSE RC1 is just finished and getting uploaded to our mirrors.  If our
18:02  <AJaeger> internal tests do not find an RC1 shipment blocker, it will be
18:02  <AJaeger> released tomorrow afternoon.
18:02  <AJaeger> I'm accepting now only fixes for Blocker bugs and will additionally accept patches that look safe.
18:02  <AJaeger> But some of the bugs that get reported might only get fixed via online update - or will be postponed for 10.3.
18:02  <AJaeger> So, in my testing I'm interesting in real shipment blockers which are: Installation not working and data loss.
18:03  <AJaeger> During the last 2 weeks we've received lots of bug reports, fixed many of them - and RC1 really looks like an RC to me now ;-)
18:03  <AJaeger> Thanks for all your help!
18:03  * yaloki slips a "thanks for all the work" ;)
18:04  <AJaeger> Sorry, I'm fighting since 11 hours with RC1 and it's just done - so I'm a bit brief now.
18:04  <AJaeger> So, let's open the round for questions on 10.2!
18:04 @<henne> any questions regarding 10.2 or the RC process?
18:04  <yaloki> is factory synced ?
18:04  <yaloki> I mean, factory==RC1 ? if not, when ?
18:04  <AJaeger> yaloki: Not yet, will happen during the night.
18:04  <yaloki> AJaeger: ok, thanks
18:04  <aka_druid_> AJaeger: is unticking zmd really removing zmd and the helpers?
18:05  <AJaeger> aka_druid_: during installation: Yes, exactly.
18:05  <AJaeger> If you do an update: You need to double check.
18:05  <aka_druid_> Im happy enough, then
18:05  <Tsuroerusu> AJaeger: I saw the "bug prioritization" post on the mailinglist, and as far as I understand, some bugs will be left in the final release. What kind of bugs are these? Are they the kind of bugs my mom would stumble into, if I were to upgrade her computer fra 10.0 to 10.2?
18:05  <AJaeger> But during installation, you can easily choose between the "Enterprise Software management (ZENworks)" pattern and the "openSUSE Software Management" pattern.
18:05  <AJaeger> Intall either of them.
18:06  <AJaeger> Tsuroerusu: I don't know your mom ;-)
18:06  <AJaeger> Tsuroerusu: Every release has some bugs, I do hope that there'S nothing that will block her working.
18:07 @<henne> any more questions or can i send AJaeger back to backing RC1? :)
18:07  <yaloki> it has been asked a few times about having a test repository with updates to actually test the updates
18:07  <AJaeger> And as I've said: If she find such a bug at Christmas and reports it, we consider releasing an online update next year (once we're back from Christmas vacation).
18:07  <cb400f> AJaeger: do we know anything about 10.2 being able to run on PS3?
18:07  <yaloki> will something be done for that ?
18:07  <Tsuroerusu> AJaeger: Let's just say that when she uses Windows on my sister's laptop, she sometimes forgets how to move a window on the screen, or how to open up Firefox even when there's an icon for it on the desktop. Would that type of user run into anything that would make him or her scream "WHERE'S MY WINDOWS???" :P ?
18:07  <AJaeger> yaloki: We did this with beta2 - there is such an update repository out there.
18:07  <yaloki> AJaeger: ok, thanks -- sorry, didn't follow the whole thread on the list
18:07  <AJaeger> It's setup by default - we just screwed up and forgot to add two more packages to the default install to make it even better.
18:08 @<henne> Tsuroerusu: this question is unanswerable. of course there will be bugs but we generally dont try to release shit you cant use :)
18:08  <AJaeger> Tsuroerusu: I hope not - but will not promise anything here.
18:09  <AJaeger> cb400f: PS3?  We don't have one here for testing :-(  I have not seen reports.  I guess this is a 10.3 target...
18:09  <cb400f> ok
18:09 @<henne> any other questions regardin 10.2?
18:09  <yaloki> AI for cb400f: fly to Japan and bring back a PS3 for AJ ^^
18:10  <fxrsliberty> HERE
18:10  <Tsuroerusu> henne: I know, but I mean stuff like something not working right or the distro generally having more of a "tech preview" feel to it instead of a solid finalized release. (Not saying 10.2 is a tech preview, just asking if it is because some bugs won't get fixed in the final release).
18:10  <yaloki> fxrsliberty: shoot
18:10 @<henne> Tsuroerusu: we will never release a distro that has tech preview quality
18:10  <cboltz> is there a chance for fixing lower rated bugs, like #218552 (which can be very annoying ;-)
18:11  <AJaeger> Tsuroerusu: The testing period for Windows is much larger than for openSUSE 10.2 - and the time spend on QA for SLED is also larger than the one for 10.2.
18:11  <fxrsliberty> wa saying I'd vote for the japan trip
18:11  <yaloki> !bug 218552
18:11  <AJaeger> Tsuroerusu: I use it and I'M happy ;-)
18:11  <SUSEhelp> yaloki: Bug 218552 - endless loop in YaST2 inst_source if source not available See https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=218552&x=10&y=8&=Find
18:11  <Tsuroerusu> AJaeger: Fair enough, you eat your own dog food I assume ;)
18:11  <AJaeger> yaloki: Is this really not fixed?  Strange...
18:11  <yaloki> AJaeger: I don't know, cboltz was asking ;)
18:12  <Tsuroerusu> fxrsliberty: No kidding, might get interesting :P
18:12  <AJaeger> Ah, sorry.
18:12  <aka_druid_> SUSEhelp: s/preview quality/preview quality again, except for 10.1/
18:12  * yaloki checks, but bugzilla is slow
18:12  <cboltz> the bug is "assigned" - not fixed. I can tell more after installing RC1 ;-)
18:12  <fxrsliberty> I have a 10.3 target question
18:12  <AJaeger> cboltz: Not for the goldmaster - but this looks like an online update candidate.
18:12  <dead_rose> henne, pls moderate the channel to speed up meeting
18:12  <AJaeger> fxrsliberty: Ask!
18:13  <cboltz> AJaeger: What about the "grep" workaround I proposed?
18:13  <fxrsliberty> I have heard that LTSP is finally being considered is this true?
18:13 @<henne> cboltz: discuss this in the bug or with duncan directly
18:13 @<henne> not here
18:13  <aka_druid_> fxrsliberty: ? It works its been several releases
18:13  <cboltz> (should be easy and solve at least most problems ;-)
18:13  <AJaeger> fxrsliberty: Yes, we're going to look into this in the future.  It's still in the evaluation phase.
18:13  <fxrsliberty> THANK GOD! I have been installing the manual bits for two years
18:14  <darix-> fxrsliberty: regarding school server related stuff you should contact kl_eisbaer
18:14  <fxrsliberty> THANK YOU
18:14 @<henne> okay guys. please stay on topic!
18:14 @<henne> any questions regarding the development of 10.2 or can we do the next topic?
18:14  <dead_rose> what about xen in 10.2 ?
18:14 @<henne> what about it?
18:14  <AJaeger> dead_rose: Should work.
18:15  <AJaeger> dead_rose: Go ahead and use it ;-)
18:15  <dead_rose> sowwy ... no hvm
18:15  <yaloki> next topic ?
18:15  <yaloki> henne: next topic please ^^
18:16 @<henne> okay next topic
18:16 @<henne> * Status wiki
18:16 @<henne> notlocalhorst?
18:16  <notlocalhorst> wiki: nothing new from me, but we are open for new wikis again. Dutch seems to be the next ...
18:16  <notlocalhorst> questions?
18:16 @<henne> okay next topic
18:16 @<henne> * Status BuildService
18:17 @<henne> adrianS?
18:17  <adrianS> I am maybe not up2date (because of a three day meeting)
18:17  <darix-> mls is back
18:17  <adrianS> Michael is working on the job killing mechanism
18:17  <adrianS> Gnome people did start to import the packages
18:17  <adrianS> which do not build yet
18:17  <adrianS> bauersman: do you want something to add from your side ?
18:18  <rodrigo> adrianS: yeah, there's a bug about the glib2 issue, we are not sure what's wrong there
18:18  <darix-> adrianS: a few small enhancements for the web ui
18:18  <adrianS> rodrigo: I just commented in bugzilla about that ;)
18:18  <rodrigo> ok
18:18  <adrianS> rodrigo: seems to be a packaging bug for me
18:18  <darix-> like ajax based search in the project listing
18:18  <bauersman> adrianS: no
18:19 @<henne> okay
18:19  <adrianS> okay, any questions regarding the build service ?
18:19  <yaloki> Q: is it intended to push the/a search interface to public (soon) ?
18:19  <rodrigo> adrianS: why would it build in autobuild but not in the bs?
18:19  <rodrigo> adrianS: well, will continue the conversation on the bug if you prefer
18:19  <darix-> rodrigo: ask in #opensuse-buildservice
18:19  <adrianS> rodrigo: because you use a broken gnome-filesystem IMHO
18:19  <bauersman> about search interface: it is planned (for a long time, true) but not easy
18:20  <yaloki> ok. one can search using google and site:software.opensuse.org but it's.. well.. suboptimal
18:20  <rodrigo> adrianS: ok, that might be
18:20  <yaloki> it's a pity to have that many packages there but most people don't even know about them or can't find them
18:20  <adrianS> yaloki: yes
18:20  <adrianS> yaloki: I have already the first 100 lines of code of an end user app, if that makes some hope
18:21  <yaloki> and yes I know BS is still tagged "beta" but still, so many packages in there
18:21  <yaloki> adrianS: ok
18:21  <bauersman> mls implemented the search on backend side, I'll probably just forward it until the frontend search is usable
18:21  <yaloki> does it have some sort of priority ?
18:21 @<henne> any other questions regarding the buildservice?
18:21  <adrianS> yaloki: I should spent 10% of my time
18:21  <cboltz> Is there a chance to get rid of the ":" in repository names?
18:21  <yaloki> adrianS: fine, I guess that's "high" ;)
18:22  <darix> yaloki: lets continue in the buildservice channel
18:22  <darix> cboltz: no.
18:22 @<henne> yes please
18:22  <yaloki> ok, my Q closed
18:22 @<henne> discuss details about implementation on the mailinglist/irc channel
18:22  <darix> cboltz: maybe. ... but we need namespacing.
18:22 @<henne> next topic?
18:22  <adrianS> yes, go on
18:22 @<henne> okay
18:22 @<henne> * Q&A Section
18:22  <cboltz> OK, I'll reopen the discussion on the ML ;-)
18:22 @<henne> theres a question in the wiki
18:23 @<henne> Will the 10.2 release have mono 1.2 or will it miss it this time around?
18:23  <darix> cboltz: come to #opensuse-buildservice please
18:23  <fxrsliberty> I have a opensuse site layout question
18:23  <darix> rodrigo: can you comment on that?
18:23  <AJaeger> henne: Far too late for Mono 1.2.
18:23 @<henne> as far as i can see no mono 1.2
18:23  <rodrigo> I am not sure, let me ask
18:23 @<henne> yeah thought so
18:24  <AJaeger> We would need to test the complete stack to ensure we do not have regressions.
18:24 @<henne> fxrsliberty: shoot
18:24  <fxrsliberty> Could there be a K12 solutions portion?
18:24  <Tsuroerusu> AJaeger: I think the past has showed you one too many examples of how bad that can get ;)
18:24  <darix> fxrsliberty: what the hack is k12?
18:24 @<henne> fxrsliberty: please be more specific
18:24  <fxrsliberty> school
18:24  <yaloki> darix: schoools
18:25 @<henne> fxrsliberty: its a wiki. start a project
18:25  <darix> yaloki: it doesnt tell me more
18:25  <fxrsliberty> A place to submit how to's and other software linkd
18:25  <adrianS> fxrsliberty: somehting like a wiki ?
18:26 @<henne> we already have all that in place
18:26  <fxrsliberty> yes but more , things like using the open school server
18:26  <fxrsliberty> ponit me please
18:26  <fxrsliberty> point me please
18:26 @<henne> http://en.opensuse.org
18:26  <fxrsliberty> LOL
18:26  <parth> can we have a video tutorials specific for openSuse similar to ubutuvideo.com
18:27  <parth> and can we put those on our wiki
18:27  <adrianS> would be possible ...
18:27 @<henne> parth: i like them very much. i will see if i can find some time to do them
18:27  <adrianS> who is creating them ? ;)
18:27  <darix> adrianS: you
18:27 @<henne> Action Item henne: create installation/usage videos
18:27  <adrianS> or maybe parth did volunteer ?
18:27  <fxrsliberty> i have submitted a few "how to's to cool solutions but need a more topical place
18:28  <parth> and also we need to have case studies for suse on our wiki
18:28  <fxrsliberty> k12.opensuse.org would be nice
18:28 @<henne> fxrsliberty: you create the place yourself. just create the Schools page and start from there
18:28  <adrianS> fxrsliberty: no problem to create that, but someone has to deliver some content for it
18:29  <fxrsliberty> not that sufisticated <<<<
18:29 @<henne> parth: betterdesktop.org is already a opensuse project
18:29  <fxrsliberty> I can write and submit how to's
18:29  <adrianS> fxrsliberty: and we can create k12.o.o and point to that page ...
18:29 @<henne> fxrsliberty: please drop this here now and get familiar with the wiki. if you have problems using it then ask on opensuse-wiki@opensuse.org
18:29  <fxrsliberty> OK
18:29  <fxrsliberty> thanks
18:30  <cboltz> henne: your AI is https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=223288
18:30 @<henne> parth: willing to help me with the videos?
18:30  <parth> yup
18:30 @<henne> parth: then add yourself to the bug please :)
18:30 @<henne> so i know how to contact you
18:30  <dead_rose> proposing to include in 10.3 rt request tracker ... beside otrs
18:30 @<henne> dead_rose: use the wiki wishlist please
18:30  <darix> dead_rose: would it be enough to have it in the buildservice?
18:30  <dead_rose> 10x
18:30  <AJaeger> dead_rose: Let'S build it in the buildservice first.
18:31  <darix> so users can install it from rpm?
18:31  <dead_rose> darix, think so
18:31  <darix> dead_rose: do you want to make the package?
18:31  <darix> i would guide you through spec writing
18:31  <rodrigo> about mono 1.2 question: it seems it won't make it to 10.2, 1.1.8 will
18:31  <dead_rose> yup ... it is just a set of perl scripts
18:31 @<henne> okay any other general questions?
18:32 @<henne> not?
18:32  <parth> can we host cool solutions on suse wiki
18:32  <cboltz> What about better wishlist handling?
18:32  <cboltz> It was discussed in the ML some time ago to use FATE - but I didn't see any news about it...
18:32  <yaloki> parth: please don't, they're just full of rubbish
18:32  <adrianS> parth: cool solutions is a novell commercial thing, I personally to not want this below opensuse.org
18:32 @<henne> adrianS: do you know anything from klaas regarding fate@opensuse?
18:33  <adrianS> parth: but you link to it at some places, if it makes sense
18:33  <adrianS> henne: he had no updates about this last week
18:33  <adrianS> henne: I will ask again
18:33 @<henne> cboltz: there you go...
18:33 @<henne> okay
18:33  <adrianS> have a nice evening :)
18:33 @<henne> any other questions?
18:33  * adrianS has to drink a beer with an old-old former suse guy ....
18:33  <cboltz> adrianS: Do you need a reminder in bugzilla? ;-)
18:34  <adrianS> cboltz: for fate ? doesn't hurt
18:34  <cb400f> Is there any way some of the suseregister statistics could be made public?
18:34  <michl> there is a way
18:35  <cboltz> OK, I'll open an AI: better wishlist handling using FATE
18:35  <_Marcus_> at least a snapshot of the numbers could be done ;)
18:35  <michl> the current outcome is partly broken
18:35  <michl> so we have in some areas 234% of something
18:35 @<henne> cool
18:35  <notlocalhorst> we are better then 100% .. cool!
18:36  * henne wants a raise
18:36  <michl> when the outcome is correct we can give information to the public
18:36  <fxrsliberty> could 10.3 have as a "pattern" a school server?
18:36  <darix> fxrsliberty: please talk to kl_eisbaer :)
18:36  <fxrsliberty> ok
18:36  <cb400f> michl: ok, I'll be waiting
18:37 @<henne> any other questions?
18:37  <cboltz> The FATE AI is https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=223290
18:37 @<henne> not?
18:38  <cboltz> what's the status of the mailinglist migration
18:38  <yaloki> cboltz: opensuse@ is now full of fud
18:38  <cboltz> (I mean the "small" tasks like compressed mbox etc.)
18:38  <yaloki> ah ^^
18:38 @<henne> cboltz: you didnt check the archive since sunday or? :)
18:38  <cboltz> no, I didn't ;-)
18:39 @<henne> shame on you. compressed mbox is done
18:39  <cboltz> Thanks! :-)
18:39 @<henne> the other stuff i do when i find time
18:39 @<henne> the general migration is done
18:40 @<henne> any more questions?
18:40 @<henne> okay. then i would like to remind you of the Novell/MS Q&A session on monday. same time, same channel
18:41  <darix> henne: i thought #opensuse
18:41 @<henne> nat, aj and holger will be here to answer any remaining questions
18:41  <dead_rose> 10x
18:41  <aka_druid_> darix: you thought wrongly
18:41 @<henne> darix: stop thinking. it seems not to work for you ;)
18:41  <darix> dead_rose: for packaging rt join #opensuse-buildservice
18:41 @<henne> ok
18:41  <aka_druid_> AJaeger: ping
18:41 @<henne> we are done for today
18:41  <darix> *reassigns all bugs to henne and stops thinking*
18:41 @<henne> thanks for participating
18:41  <darix> henne: have fun with net-snmp :p
18:42  <AJaeger> aka_druid_: Sorry, needed a bio break.
18:42  <aka_druid_> np
18:42 @<henne> the next meeting will be a 2006.12.06
18:42  <aka_druid_> heh
18:42 @<henne> same time, same channel
18:42 @<henne> good night and good luck :)