Started at --> 14:05:24 jpr: Good (very early morning!) to you all! jpr: Welcome to the openSUSE GNOME Team meeting munkii: not for me ^_^ chen: morning jpr! jpr: this is the montly meeting we switch times for to help australia and asia join jpr: at some sort of reasonable time :-) jpr: next week's meeting will be back at the regular time Darragh: pity. this is perfect... for some of us. dliang: hehe captain_magnus: Hehe jpr: i'm glad you all think its a laughing matter! jpr: :-) *btimothy finally dares to turn on the room light

Started at --> 14:07:51 suseROCKS: Turn it offfff! munkii: well, somebody is a little cranky jpr: i don't see federico this morning yet, but i'll get this topic started jpr: several meetings ago we discussed about bug handling jpr: bug squashing days, themes, etc how those all worked together jpr: we decided to separate those out jpr: federico1: dude! thank you, just in time federico1: hey hey jpr: <jpr> i don't see federico this morning yet, but i'll get this topic started jpr: * srag_ (n=sragavan@123.236.219.179) has joined #opensuse-gnome jpr: <jpr> several meetings ago we discussed about bug handling jpr: <jpr> bug squashing days, themes, etc how those all worked together jpr: <jpr> we decided to separate those out jpr: federico1: care to proceed from there? srag_: sorry to be late... just got connected federico1: sure, let's see... federico1: we have the bug plan, which is pretty much done federico1: and the bug classification, which is definitely not done :) federico1: now we can start having bug days with particular topics *munkii hides federico1: some topics we had in mind: multiscreen/widescreen bugs (like the one with Intel graphics cards everyone is having), file chooser bugs, bugs in the photo workflow, bugs in main-menu, etc. suseROCKS: federico1 I noticed you were doing a bunch of bug classification the other day. Caught some that i filed a while back and had forgotten about. Thanks. Darragh: pity. I know accessibility bugs aren't at the top of everyones list but it would be great if we can consider fitting these in somewhere. captain_magnus: federico1: All good... But... R we suppose to fix them, or just hunt dups down?? federico1: Darragh: oh, yes, definitely accessibility bugs federico1: captain_magnus: fix them, of course! captain_magnus: :-) captain_magnus: All in srag_ is now known as srag *captain_magnus wonders if jpr got his dual screen together federico1: though I'm not sure how many bugs we can fix in a single day... "$person1 fixes bug N, $person2 fixes bug M, etc."? captain_magnus: federico1: You can't fix it all? Hehe... jpr: federico1: will it depend on the topic? jpr: maybe we should concentrate on topics with a lot of small buglets? captain_magnus: Xinerama stuff is huge and it doesn't work federico1: jpr: yeah, probably. We should also make some preparation work; say "for this bug topic, you need a development environment set up for package-foo and package-bar.rpm" a few days in advance jpr: yes, thats a great idea federico1: so that on the bug day we don't run into "oh, but I need these 20 packages to compile foo.rpm, which I don't have yet" suseROCKS: Is there any post-squashing testing done to ensure the bugs really are fixed? Darragh: suggestion: by ensuring all required dependencies are in a specific repository you will greatly reduce the time required for any issues that do emerge in this regard. limiting the amount of hunting involved. captain_magnus: suseROCKS: Don't be difficullt :-) federico1: hmmm, the build service is pretty consistent in terms of speed these days, isn't it? can we assume that it will take less than an hour to compile something, so that we can fix a bug and give people a package for testing quickly? Darragh: SuSE Rocks has a very good point. jpr: federico1: yes, i think we can jpr: and a .ymp script would do what darragh wants probably Darragh: when the gnome session issue was fixed before the release of 10.3, some basic testing of a lot of the depenent processes would have reduced your eventual bug count by 6 captain_magnus: federico1: With the xinerma stuff, it depends who actually got it... federico1: Darragh: yeah, all the dependencies should already be in the distro repository captain_magnus: I vote for fixing it, but.... Not a lot of people seems to have it set up suseROCKS: Cappy, don't be difficult captain_magnus: suseROCKS: :-) federico1: suseROCKS: do we still have the verified/closed states for bugs? :) suseROCKS: err... umm... suseROCKS: At this hour, everything is closed. federico1: so, let's pick our first bug topic FunkyPenguin: accessibility? Darragh: ah I like your thinking. captain_magnus: Xinerama suseROCKS: Do we have enough to be worthy of a topic? Let me check. captain_magnus: jpr: ??? jpr: captain_magnus: yes? suseROCKS: I count 13 under accessibility right now and some are assigned. I suggest we wait a bit and try to hunt down even more bugs before giving it a topic day captain_magnus: Boss... Don't fall a sleep... You are running this! :-) jpr: i thought we were picking a topic :-) captain_magnus: Hehe jpr: i'm up for xinerama or the main menu captain_magnus: Both? captain_magnus: :-) jpr: either to start suseROCKS: Not to mention that some a11y bugs can be tackled via other topics. Like the main-menu topic day for example. captain_magnus: I'm up for the mm then munkii: main-menu, because this actually concerns everybody Darragh: well, the issues in yast at the moment. *unreported* could actually take a while. to solve from what I gather. with accessibility the GTK version of yast will launch however the nodes all show errors. just trying to get a core dump before reporting it formaly. jpr: federico1: so, main menu? captain_magnus: mm +1 suseROCKS: Darragh, I don't see any bugs filed under gnome-accessibility yet for Yast. federico1: yeah, main-menu looks like the best choice - it has a bunch of dependent bugs captain_magnus: mw|screen: ?? FunkyPenguin: looks like we have a winner *federico1 summons sreeves munkii: ok, enough with the voting, let's get into it jpr: federico1: sreeves is on vacation this week :-) captain_magnus: I volunetter to have a look at half of the mm bugs.... jpr: federico1: when would be the next question federico1: ok, which days do we have that are *not* for a specific thing (packaging, squashing, etc)? :) federico1: or spread it through one week? munkii: what are the mm bugs again? federico1: I'm liking the one-week idea; a single day is pretty crazy federico1: munkii: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=341831 captain_magnus: munkii: Lots bugbot: openSUSE bug 341831 in openSUSE 10.3 (GNOME) "Tracker bug for gnome-main-menu" [Normal,New] jpr: i'm up for trying the one week thing, although I'm a little concerned we'll spread the effort a bit too thin suseROCKS: That bugbot is so knowledgable. I wonder if she's single. jpr: but it might be a nice experiment munkii: zomg! that's alot, i haven't noticed so much bugs! Darragh: can people consistently offer that amount of time? at least a day is easy to coordinate in terms of man power. I would have thought. munkii: did we include this in the bug squash days? captain_magnus: jpr: To thin? One product? jpr: the effort and the motivation will be hard to keep up over a whole week I think federico1: well, not everyone has to fix bugs in it... but more than one person at a time (which is the current status), should be good :) jpr: hehe jpr: +1 then captain_magnus: Menu is pretty important... federico1: ok federico1: next week? hpj: +1 week captain_magnus: +1 munkii: +1 hpj: i guess we'll have the tracker bug in the topic munkii: what are we voting for? :P captain_magnus: [Hehe jpr: hpj: good idea jpr: federico1: i'd like 2 weeks jpr: from now jpr: that is jpr: ie week of dec 17 federico1: sure, why not federico1: ooh, the tiles-2 branch still needs merging, right? jpr: AI: Federico to schedule and announce bug hunting for main menu dec 17 jpr: federico1: well, it needs review captain_magnus: For 11.0 that is right?? jpr: and possible merging munkii: i've hacked the package-manager script for slab to make it work with smart package manager if anybody is interested jpr: federico1: anything else to add? federico1: captain_magnus: I'd really like to make this available for 10.3 munkii: that's it --> http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=6824A9A36D8F98FD munkii: i don't know what to do with it though :P federico1: jpr: I can work on merging it next week; I should be done with intlclock by then captain_magnus: federico1: Are you sure? captain_magnus: federico1: Many bugs are more RFE's... jpr: federico1: cool federico1: captain_magnus: maybe not push it for 10.3 updates, but just make it installable without requiring a ton of updated packages suseROCKS: I see the word "slab" used all the time. What exactly is slab? jpr: suseROCKS: wait for Q&A :_) federico1: suseROCKS: it was the old name of the main-menu captain_magnus: federico1: Yeah, that can work

Started at --> 14:35:09 munkii: suseROCKS: slab = main-menu jpr: ok suseROCKS: ok jpr: so jpr: all the great dev work that his been going on jpr: in packagekit, pulseaudio, NM 0.7 etc jpr: has been mainly targetted at 11.0 jpr: although in some cases we've been able to provide 10.3 packages in the build service captain_magnus: jpr: All good... but is that in factory? jpr: well, thats the point, its moving in to factory in the next couple of weeks captain_magnus: I run factory on my laptop and I don't see any of these new versions jpr: intl clock should be in this week jpr: NM 0.7 and pulseaudio early next week jpr: package kit soon jpr: but the bigger questions coming are GNOME 2.21.x captain_magnus: I also don't see any of the "GNOME policies" that we decided upon jpr: one moment :-) *captain_magnus is waiting... :-) jpr: so the question is at what point to we push into more direct testing jpr: of Factory jpr: (at least in my mind thats the question) captain_magnus: Factory is factory??? jpr: i have it running on secondary machines now, but... jpr: yes jpr: captain_magnus: now - your question on the policies? captain_magnus: Not stable, push everything there... How else can we test it? *jpr is not sure he followed that Darragh: just a thought. what about getting OpenSuSE support testing the factory changes. the only reason they don't at the moment is they haven't really been asked and they possibly haven't had the right internal support. jpr: captain_magnus: well, the goal is to keep it in a testable state captain_magnus: jpr: I'm thinking that we need to start pushing all of our ideas and new versions to factory... jpr: but yes, we could decide its too early to try captain_magnus: Since when is factolry stable? hpj: Darragh: can you guys deal with a lot of breakage, though? jpr: its not, but that doesn't mean it can't be usable like debian captain_magnus: Hmm... jpr: one thought is to project wide or at http://en.opensuse.org/GNOME/Factory Darragh: yes.. we can. we've a novell test PC here and a few older machines that can be used for this type of stuff. all we need is a bit more communication between you guys and the people here. jpr: list the gotchas and how to fix them captain_magnus: jpr: We are talking about 2 different things.... jpr: captain_magnus: we are? captain_magnus: One is: New standards (4 workspaces for instance) hpj: Darragh: aha, so it wouldn't be on your main machines captain_magnus: Second is new versions Darragh: oh no. they need to be used for the usual troubleshooting stuff. captain_magnus: So policies and versions needs to be different captain_magnus: jpr: You don't agree? Darragh: it could benefit us as well as I really need to get people here reporting more bugs. a culture of bug reporting could be built up by making them come into contact with more bugs and breaks via the factory distribution. jpr: i think the policy stuff is minor suseROCKS: I'm on the last stage of hardware upgrading so I'll probably start working with 11.0 this weekend if possible. jpr: we really need to be on top of the new versions jpr: esp. for reporting to upstream GNOME during the development cycle of 2.21.x hpj: Darragh: if you want to do it, i say go for it - and let us know what you need from us captain_magnus: jpr: I don't agree... We had problems with GNOME and *one* desktop (reviews etc)... We need to start pushing that jpr: captain_magnus: sure, but relative to stability thats minor jpr: captain_magnus: and its not really the key to our testing imho captain_magnus: Yes, but.... jpr: but yes, we should make some policy decisions and make the changes soon captain_magnus: Testing includes having new defaults captain_magnus: Not saying that it would break things but it is still testing jpr: yes, my point is that it won't break much jpr: so the key issue is testing of big new blocks of upgrades captain_magnus: We can't wait until the last week before we intrdouce this stuff jpr: captain_magnus: we are agreeing :-) captain_magnus: jpr: Yah! :-) jpr: but the larger breakages are likely to occur from big upgrades of GNOME, X, etc jpr: SO jpr: given all that captain_magnus: jpr: Fair but...... jpr: it sounded like jpr: people are more comfortable jpr: getting factory going on secondary machines still captain_magnus: We *still* need to start introducing out new defaults jpr: to see where we're at jpr: captain_magnus: that is a development question, not a testing question captain_magnus: Is it? captain_magnus: Never mind... :-) jpr: so captain_magnus: I'll bring it up later... Hehe jpr: it sounded like we have some volunteers jpr: to do some more factory testing jpr: at least on secondary machines jpr: correct? captain_magnus: I am all for testing factoryt... (In fact, I am at the moment) jpr: do people need help getting factory installed? hpj: Darragh? suseROCKS: my goal is to make that "secondary machine" my primary machine munkii: i'm a little busy with college stuff these days, but sure, i'll give it a spin next week federico1: there are isos now, right? jpr: suseROCKS: yes, that should be the eventual goal captain_magnus: suseROCKS: I think that's the way to try it btimothy: jpr: is there a way to install factory right "out of the box" instead of having to install 10.3 first and update? captain_magnus: btimothy: Yes suseROCKS: No I meant making it my primary machine as early as this weekend. munkii: where can i find the isos? captain_magnus: You can (should be able to) install it from the mini iso that comes with factory btimothy: we should link people to a wiki page for a howto on installing factory suseROCKS: btimothy +1 captain_magnus: btimothy: We had a few bugs with doing that but they should be resolved now jpr: captain_magnus: does the wiki have full instructions on that? captain_magnus: jpr: Don't know... captain_magnus: jpr: We can put it as a task and I can write it down jpr: is there a volunteer to own digging up the instructions? jpr: ooh jpr: that sounds like captain_magnus :-) jpr: AI: captain_magnus to write up factory installation pointers and send to the list captain_magnus: 2 easy... jpr: AI: Darragh and suseROCKS to test instructions? suseROCKS: I guess so suseROCKS: kinda hard NOT to test the instructions :-) federico1: http://en.opensuse.org/Factory points to http://en.opensuse.org/Download which points to http://en.opensuse.org/Development_Version captain_magnus: Hehe federico1: and the last one is outdated; it says there's no development version currently federico1: and it doesn't have links to ISOs jpr: suseROCKS: cool, thanks - i was meaning more in a "yes we've tested these, everyone jump in" kind of sense suseROCKS: Cappy, will you email me as soon as the instructions are done? captain_magnus: suseROCKS: I will email the ml jpr: I think this initial discussion is good for now, but I think we'll talk a lot more about factory over the coming weeks and how/when/what to test

Started at --> 14:53:21 jpr: btimothy: take it away suseROCKS: jpr I know. I was just being a smartass which is very unusual for me. *btimothy wonders if captain_magnus is more awake to drive the tasks this week? ;) jpr: hehe jpr: suseROCKS: its the time captain_magnus: btimothy: No, I just arrived... btimothy: really ... all we need for tasks this week is for everyone to load the page and check their items btimothy: http://en.opensuse.org/GNOME/Tasks btimothy: i realized that i never saw an email from last week w/ AI's listed out btimothy: so i haven't added those to the tasks page btimothy: was rodrigo gonna put that together? captain_magnus: btimothy: We should point fingers at jpr and munkii :-) jpr: yes, he probably forgot before going on vacation jpr: he'll be back on Monday btimothy: munkii: since you're around this week, can you give us an update for your sample bugs? munkii: btimothy: sorry i was a littlew busy with college and stuff, i'm working on it *federico1 pushes the bug classification ETA further back captain_magnus: jpr: Will you manage to do something about your red item? munkii: i'll set my eta to next week jpr: captain_magnus: yes btimothy: munkii: k, no worries, thanks in advance for updating your status on the page captain_magnus: jpr: Cool... Can you update the tasks to reflect the eta jpr: yes munkii: btimothy: one thing about this task though, how do i know when i have finished? btimothy: munkii: i would assume when rodrigo/federico have said so? ;) captain_magnus: btimothy: We still need to do something aboth the orange ones... They have not moved for a while jpr: captain_magnus: actually our feature one is dead jpr: captain_magnus: openfate was decided without us jpr: i missed the project meeting due to other work meetings :-/ btimothy: federico1: does your bug categorization status reflect everything that's been done up to today? captain_magnus: jpr: Whas that a Yes or a No for Fate? federico1: btimothy: yes jpr: captain_magnus: yes for fate *munkii sets himself on overlocking captain_magnus: Cool... btimothy: federico1: k, so possibly set a new ETA? federico1: btimothy: just did :) captain_magnus: jpr: I'll move the task... btimothy: federico1: ah, ;) jpr: captain_magnus: maybe update the proposal page with the decision info federico1: munkii: did you have any bugs for us? btimothy: mw|screen: community packages? captain_magnus: jpr: Sure... I'll talk to you and cyberorg later on about it btimothy: mw|screen: is that done (due today) jpr: AI: captain_magnus , jpr , cyberorg to note final feature decision captain_magnus: btimothy: You're beating a dead horse :-) captain_magnus: He's a sleep :-) munkii: federico1: considering what? *btimothy is asleep too :) btimothy: shall we move on then? jpr: munkii: i suggest that if you don't know what your action item really is, you just kill it :-) captain_magnus: hpj: Still no decision about svn (or external code)? hpj: captain_magnus: no captain_magnus: hpj: What's holding you up? munkii: jpr: i know i suggested in the first place, i have to review the logs then :P jpr: ok :-) hpj: captain_magnus: umm, i need to look into the opensuse project on forge

Started at --> 15:02:41 captain_magnus: hpj: Fair enough... You mind putting a ETA on that project so that we can move from orange (to red)? :-) jpr: ok, real quick jpr: its about time to think about another meeting theme hpj: captain_magnus: ok jpr: http://en.opensuse.org/GNOME/Meetings/Themes jpr: we've done bluetooth and NM so far jpr: suggestions for the next one? jpr: I was thinking evolution captain_magnus: Xinerama :-) *jpr looks at srag captain_magnus: (Hurts me...) hpj: ooooh, evolution jpr: captain_magnus: well, we could have the X team come and talk about new X stuff suseROCKS: Evo would be good srag: Blame for that, I was OOF due to personal reasons and back full time just today jpr: so, the options I hear are jpr: Evolution jpr: X jpr: votes? captain_magnus: X +1 suseROCKS: Wait... before voting... jpr: evolution +1 srag: ofcourse, Evolution +1 chen: evolution+1 captain_magnus: Bah! :-) suseROCKS: when would the next theme meeting be? hpj: evolution +1, although i think the X stuff sounds interesting too suseROCKS: evo +1 jpr: suseROCKS: 1 or 2 weeks from now federico1: evo +1 captain_magnus: Evo it is.. :-( srag: captain_magnus, :) jpr: srag: you up for that? :-) suseROCKS: Earlier the better considering we're entering the Xmas weeks. federico1: munkii: sorry, I thought about your task on the tasks page :) srag: jpr, sure. jpr: great jpr: AI: JP schedule Evolution theme meeting with srag captain_magnus: srag: Not like that... It's just that evo works for me but X doesn't :-)

Started at --> 15:06:10 jpr: no wiki questions this week jpr: but questions in general? srag: calvin, oh srag: Oops srag: captain_magnus, oh captain_magnus: jpr: Yes, can you try to get an official server to log this channel j have no idea how to do that, does anyone else? munkii: jpr: yeah, when will we see the first factory alpha? captain_magnus: jpr: IRC Bot captain_magnus: munkii:Alpha0 is on the way captain_magnus: (Might be internal???) jpr: AI: captain_magnus to tell jpr how to get channel logged better jpr: other questions? jpr: low on questions this week :-) munkii: another question about factory? jpr: sure suseROCKS: I think we're kinda saving up our questions for when we start installing factory jpr: hehe suseROCKS: Oooh I have a question... jpr: munkii: hurry up if you want to ask :-) suseROCKS: I see the sun starting to rise, does anyone else see the sun rising now? captain_magnus: jpr: You wanna make factory testing a weekly agenda thing? And would that mean that we can ask questioins about versions, defaukt etc that we get with it? jpr: captain_magnus: sounds great actually munkii: ah, ,sorry, i was fixing the tasks page captain_magnus: suseROCKS: Almost :-) hpj: suseROCKS: i have the curtains drawn jpr: still too early here

Started at --> 15:11:22 suseROCKS: hpj your neighbors appreciate that! jpr: lets move one munkii: jpr: when will we start talking about 11.0 specifics, right now we are just talking about single apps and stuff captain_magnus: munkii: Factory tesing = 11.0?? jpr: munkii: lets re-ask in developer Q&A jpr: hpj: take it away munkii: ok hpj: ok, it's the update! hpj: suseROCKS is making a list of a11y apps for the new yast accessibility category hpj: suseROCKS: how's that going? suseROCKS: starting to put it together. Coolo wants it as a pattern rather than a category which actually makes sense captain_magnus: jpr: Bah! I followed the meeting agenda from our home page... Someone didn't change it from last meeting :-/ jpr: captain_magnus: arg jpr: captain_magnus: i thought i got all the links hpj: i've been working on updating gdm to latest 2.21 version, still not done suseROCKS: I'll probably open up a bug on Monday to start listing the apps for the pattern captain_magnus: jpr: We need to get better organized with that (and the topics....) hpj: on the a11y front, kristian lyngstoel volunteered to do one of the requested features for compiz hpj: the fix for "too big windows" captain_magnus: hpj: Bug reference? suseROCKS: That's awesome. That alone will knock out a bunch of bugs I filed. hpj: captain_magnus: don't have it on hand... hang on hpj: sreeves/btimothy: packagekit update? btimothy: hpj: well, not going as fast as i would like it to captain_magnus: Should we have a blocker bug for that (as we do with the main menu etc)? btimothy: sreeves is on vacation this week btimothy: i'm running into some issues with the zypp backend suseROCKS: cappy bug 343868 is an example of a too big window bug bugbot: openSUSE bug 343868 in openSUSE 10.3 (Evolution) "Evolution Preferences go past screen boundary with higher fonts" [Normal,New] https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=343868 btimothy: and a little bit of some disputes that package kit's APi is too simple btimothy: for doing things like determining package dependencies captain_magnus: suseROCKS: You should create a tracker bug for all them munkii: actually, it's whole bunch of apps who do that captain_magnus: Just so that we can keep track of them btimothy: i was hoping to put packagekit into factory this week suseROCKS: tracker bug? btimothy: but i think we should wait for possibly next week btimothy: so we can make it a little more stable jpr: btimothy: its available for testing on 10.3 now though right? btimothy: jpr: no, not really jpr: darn hpj: suseROCKS: one bug that depends on all the others using the bugzilla dependencies feature hpj: suseROCKS: so you have an entry point for everything suseROCKS: ahh got it captain_magnus: suseROCKS: One bug report that we call a "blocker". All other a11y bugs blocks that one bug report btimothy: that's the other thing. i need someone with build experience to check out my home project and see why the packages won't build for 10.3 btimothy: i will check with thoenig again today btimothy: and see if he has more ideas for it to work in 10.3 FunkyPenguin: jpr: did you make a descision on brasero as the default cd/dvd burner? captain_magnus: btimothy: All in all but... For new developpment, shouldn't we drop 10.3? jpr: FunkyPenguin: wait for q&a btimothy: captain_magnus: apparently, we'll get more people to test/try if we get it building in 10.3 hpj: captain_magnus: the kristian lyngstoel mail is at http://mail.gnome.org/archives/usability/2007-December/msg00014.html hpj: captain_magnus: for further reference jpr: the yast team requested 10.3 packages btimothy: captain_magnus: specifically, the zypp development team won't upgrade to factory captain_magnus: btimothy: I think that is wrong... We should not care about 10.3 for that... :-/ btimothy: captain_magnus: perhaps you can convince them otherwise? captain_magnus: hpj: Cool... We'll get suseROCKS to create a tracker bug for a11y :-) hpj: who can talk about pulseaudio? hpj: rodrigo is out this week jpr: i can mention it briefly btimothy: jpr gave a pretty sweet demo of pulseaudio in provo Monday :) jpr: all the packages seem to be done jpr: no more conflicts jpr: it nicely replaces esound jpr: i think mainly it would be a check in to factory remaining jpr: and updates to the patterns hpj: AI: suseROCKS to create tracker bug for a11y suseROCKS: Cappy... we will? :-) I thought the keyword was enough. Guess I h ave a bit more to learn. jpr: hopefully early next week jpr: hpj: thats all :-) hpj: ok captain_magnus: suseROCKS: Tracker bugs makes it easier to follow if you are interested hpj: so the main menu hpj: captain_magnus: want to talk about that? hpj: any news? munkii: how's tracker bugs any different from categorization? i say pick one or the other captain_magnus: I've been out of state this week so have not done anything with mm... I will talk to sreves next week and check in a patch.... hpj: ok munkii: captain_magnus: where can we get your patches? captain_magnus: Other than that, mmeeks seems interested in it as well whichs is good... :-) hpj: federico1: intlclock? captain_magnus: munkii: You can't yet... I will talk to sreves and see where I can upload my patches munkii: ah, i can wait :) captain_magnus: munkii: Worst case scenario is that I create bug reports and attach them there federico1: hpj: all the "easy" code is merged. It runs, crashes sometimes, but it lacks the map and timezone tiles in the popup - that's the difficult part to merge. I'm working on that at the moment. hpj: federico1: ETA? munkii: captain_magnus: that would suck, but i definitely have no problem with that federico1: hpj: tomorrow if all goes well jpr: the new clock is *really* nice hpj: federico1: sounds great jpr: i predict you will all drool over it federico1: oh, I haven't looked at the libgweather that hadess split out of gnome-applets captain_magnus: munkii: I',m not a developer... I do this to try to learn :-) federico1: I also need to look into that :) hpj: ok federico1: captain_magnus: dude, you are doing cool profiles --- that sounds pretty developerish to me munkii: captain_magnus: you've got to start somewhere, you know :) hpj: any topics i missed? jpr: i have two topics hpj: jpr: go on jpr: we need to start getting teams together for jpr: the Xgl/Compiz work that was outlined on factory jpr: and as per captain_magnus the policy work jpr: we need to start making a decision jpr: and submitting that to Factory captain_magnus: jpr: Xgl/Compiz? hpj: we're making that default, right? jpr: yes, some integration, a rework of the simple config tool jpr: hpj: thats the goal jpr: cyberorg has a script that helps do that hpj: will we fall back to metacity for non-accelerated setups? jpr: we need to pull it all together with cyberorg captain_magnus: I was told that everything is in place for Xgl (aiglx) / Compiz... hpj: or is it for all setups? jpr: hpj: yes, fallback hpj: ok jpr: default when hardware appropriate munkii: how do we organise with the compiz team? cyberorg: sorry, in the middle of class, it is compiz-manager package captain_magnus: myself and cyberorg wanted to write the code for it but evertything is done... captain_magnus: mw: Good morning :-) cyberorg: captain_magnus, nope, what we wanted to write is bit different than we have mw: morning jpr: AI: JP to add desktop policy to 11.0 ideas page jpr: we don't have to decide right now captain_magnus: cyberorg: Ehh... We wanted to write code that depends on the GFX card and fix Xorg up.... jpr: but volunteers should start thinking about these :-) captain_magnus: cyberorg: But I was told that it's done jpr: hpj: thanks, all done munkii: morning, mw hpj: ok, then unless someone has further reports, we're done hpj: with the 11.0 update jpr: mw: do you have a quick 2 minute summary of packaging day? hpj: Q&A time munkii: mw, have you tried voice recognition yet btw?

Started at --> 15:31:33 jpr: moving on then jpr: any other questions? munkii: i got it working, but that thing lacks a good interface, and a real perl wiz to get it working out of the box mw: well, there's a list of packages created at en.opensuse.org/Talk:Packaging/Packaging_Day (from memory) Darragh: 1. in relation to the new MM in Gnome, are all the objects / buttons etc in the focusable tab order? captain_magnus: munkii: Got an idea for the transcript thing for you... Can you pull all the AI's and put the at the end of the page? :-) munkii: captain_magnus: what transcript? munkii: ah captain_magnus: mw: What is a success? (I couldn't be there :-( munkii: the log? captain_magnus: munkii: Yeah hpj: captain_magnus: main menu question from darragh is for you, i guess :) munkii: sure i can do that federico1: Darragh: no idea - can you please test it and file a bug if that doesn't work? captain_magnus: Darragh: Yes jpr: other questions? Darragh: darragh: very hard to test when you don't know what objects you should be getting focus to. i.e. if you only get notification that there are two buttons in a dialogue but there are actually 4, you can not easily determine this via the UI when depending on Assistive technology. flat review and other similar methods are not reliable enough. captain_magnus: jpr: Yes... Did we have anyone here that could not have attended otherwise? jpr: good question jpr: i think it was easier on chen and srag and dliang jpr: and you of course :-) jpr: for sure captain_magnus: My reasons for asking is to try to decide if we should keep doing it or not... jpr: captain_magnus: i'd suggest we try one more time hpj: i propose more AIs for chen, srag and dliang in first meeting of month :) jpr: and see jpr: hehe srag: it is definitely useful. jpr: oh, flex is here too jpr: hi flex :-) srag: jpr, psankar is as well here *btimothy is gonna pay for it later today though psankar: yup srag: and lakhil as well munkii: jpr, we need a wiki page that shows all the plans aligned for 11.0, not just "ideas", ,things that are already in the workshop, you know srag: hpj, sure. captain_magnus: So... This time is useful for some people?? (Speak up :-) chen: this was a very good time for attending the meeting for us flex: Hi, I'm a good listener. :-) *btimothy would encourage participation from those who can now attend jpr: munkii: maybe - its hard with out a schedule and a way to predict how many people we'll have developing :-) Meeting ended at --> 15:38:24

AI: Federico to schedule and announce bug hunting for main menu dec 17 AI: suseROCKS to create tracker bug for a11y AI: captain_magnus to write up factory installation pointers and send to the list AI: Darragh and suseROCKS to test instructions? AI: captain_magnus , jpr , cyberorg to note final feature decision AI: JP schedule Evolution theme meeting with srag