KDE/Meetings/2007 11 14-transcript

From openSUSE

<dirk>	topics: 
<dirk>	a) old action items
<dirk>	b) jambi/qyoto packages
<dirk>	c) KDE on 11.0
<dirk>	d) community packaging event
<dirk>	e) misc
<dirk>	anything I missed?
<Bille>	nope
<Beineri>	does c) include KDE/Challenges ? :-)
<dirk>	Beineri: lets add that after b). ok?
<dirk>	lets start.. old action items
<dirk>	* KDE Team to review the community wishlist
<Beineri>	cbfoo asked on wiki about different meeting date
<Beineri>	how often again? :-)
<dirk>	Beineri: I'm fine with any other weekday, unfortunately he didn't add suggestions
<Bille>	Beineri: where's the discussion?
<apokryphos>	133t h@ckorz hate the daytime ;)
<Bille>	i don't watch _every_ page
	 * Beineri knows dirk looked at x2go after last meeting
<dirk>	"erhaps having meetings on a different weekday? Wednesday is very bad for me personally. Maybe others are in the same predicament and thus can't take active part in most project meetings as well as KDE meetings. If meetings were on different weekdays maybe it would be more likely that people could participate in at least one of the two regularly. (cb400f)"
<dirk>	Bille: ^^
<Bille>	suggestion: rotate it tue/wed/thu
<Bille>	and maybe do some midday/late ones too.
<dirk>	does anyone listening here :-) have suggestions on a different weekday ? :)
<dirk>	is friday better for people?
<apokryphos>	rotating tue/wed/thu sounds good
<Beineri>	that would at this time clash with GNOME on every possible Thursday then?
<mw>	in gnome-land, we do one meeting per month many hours earlier, to accomodate people in asia-pac
<Beineri>	did someone from there express interest to join kde meeting?
<detlef>	for me wednesday isn't nice, friday sound good ;)
<dirk>	Bille: the problem I have with rotation is that people might have trouble remembering when it is next time
<Fisiu>	Hello :)
<Bille>	dirk: yeah, we have ical and mail spam for that though
<Bille>	Fisiu: welcome
<dirk>	Bille: but other than that, I don't care. I would imagine that Fridays might help
<Fisiu>	just read mail about meeting :)
<Bille>	. o O (Fridays 1700UTC => pub)?
<dirk>	Bille: for SUSE people, yes. for non-SUSE people, perhaps no. ;)
<Bille>	but whatever, i am flexible and can wifi in from most places
<dirk>	ok, who's doing the AI of talking to cb400f and suggesting a new weekday?
<Bille>	Me.
<dirk>	AI: Bille: talk to cb400f about a possible new weekday/time
<Bille>	as kde PIM representative, i should be able to organise a calendar
<Bille>	hands up if you love kontact!
	 * dirk thinks that Bille *is* already in the pub
	 * Nix notes that Friday 1700UTC = 1900UTC in Istanbul which also happens to be pub time here...
	 * Nix notes that Friday 1700UTC = 1900 in Istanbul which also happens to be pub time here...
<Bille>	Nix: should only be every 2 months though, since it's biweekly
<Bille>	next item!
<Bille>	community wishlist.
<Bille>	mw suggested we could do this as Free Desktop community day
<Beineri>	/verbose Bille
<Bille>	and work through the packages together
<Beineri>	or mw ;-)
<mw>	i did
<Beineri>	that's a packager workshop? or us doing packages while being watched? ;-)
<Bille>	mw: any date in mind
<mw>	figuring that lots of kde users use a few gnome apps, and vice versa, it makes sense to combine forces
	 * jpr votes for both
<Fisiu>	I've got Q abou opensuse kde translation, after applying changes I trunk dir, how long can it take to apply them into update dir?
<Bille>	Fisiu: wait for the misc
<jpr>	maybe we could use it as a way to get some traffic to #opensuse-factory as well
<mw>	Bille: i'm thinking in about 2 weeks.  next week is problematic for people in the US (thanksgiving, with lots of people traveling), and earlier might not be enough notice
<Beineri>	Fisiu: can we hold back question until the end please?
<Fisiu>	ok, np
<Bille>	mw: weekend or weekday?
<dirk>	I'm in favour of doing it together iwth the GNOME/openSUSE team
<dirk>	I would prefer weekdays..
<dirk>	but weekends are sometimes also okay
<mw>	i'd prefer a weekday too, but that might be harder for people who don't do this full time
<Bille>	that's my thinking
<dirk>	ok, when? this month?
<Bille>	mrdocs: you interested in this?
<dirk>	I would suggest to announce it a bit in advance (more than a week)
<Bille>	dirk: in 2 weeks sounds good
<mw>	what about the 30 Nov or 1 December?
<jpr>	it would be great if we could convince coolo to publish a roadmap at the same time and really make it an 11.0 kickoff
<dirk>	jpr: wasn't there a discussion already on opensuse-project?
<dirk>	do we want to restrict it to one day? given all the timezone differences, it is two days anyway
<dirk>	so I would suggest 30/1 December
<mw>	sounds reasonable to me
<Beineri>	jpr: be careful when using the "kickoff" term, I'm always thinking thinking of start menu :-)
<jpr>	+1 (if i have vote in this meeting :-) )
<mw>	jpr: it's a joint effort, so i'd imagine you do :)
<dirk>	okay.. who's helping with the action item? jpr or mw?
<mw>	i can help
<dirk>	okay
<Bille>	Beineri: given how polarising these 'branded' technologies seem to be, and how people love to rag on them when they are late/buggy, i have copyrighted the term 'KickMe' for the next start menu we do ;)
<dirk>	AI: mw, dirk: organize community packaging two days on 30.11/1.12.
<mw>	although i don't think it needs much besides announcing it and divvying up packages
<dirk>	mw: yep, some wiki and mail writing work
<apokryphos>	sounds great =)
<dirk>	next topic?
<Bille>	and get the cookbook in shape to welcome new packagers
<Bille>	dirk: repo structure
<dirk>	argh, my AI
<dirk>	status: I've not had time to work on the wiki page since last meeting
	 * Beineri still waits for plan B :-)
<dirk>	while I wanted to split it up all in different repos, both darix and adrian convinced me meanwhile to not do that
<Bille>	so what's the current thinking?
<Beineri>	complete the plan(s), put up for discussion on mailing list
<dirk>	yep. 
<dirk>	I'll really do that the next days :)
<dirk>	* alk to qyoto packager and bring it into the KDE: prefix
<dirk>	I think that action item is all done, right Bille?
<Bille>	indeed
<dirk>	okay
<dirk>	* KDE 4 Development pattern
<dirk>	I think Beineri and I have done a first draft (Beineri mostly). 
<dirk>	we found quite some buildservice bugs though :-)
<Beineri>	we have a pattern, but the build service has (or had?) a problem to publish more than one pattern in a bs project :-)
<Bille>	subtext: if you want to try mono/c# with Qt, go here:  http://software.opensuse.org/ymp/KDE:Qt/openSUSE_10.3/qt4-qyoto.ymp
<Beineri>	you can look at/use the generated .ymp files though
<dirk>	did anyone test the pattern? did we get any feedback anywhere?
<Bille>	Beineri: is that why osc meta shows the data, but you can't see it in yast or zypper
<Bille>	dirk: i tried it, yes
<dirk>	Bille: and? :)
<Beineri>	those .ymp in here: http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE:/KDE4/openSUSE_10.3/
<Bille>	dirk: i downloaded the ymp manually
<Bille>	haven't tried building it yet
<Beineri>	either close it as fixed or defer until build service is fixed :-)
<dirk>	okay. 
<Bille>	Beineri: so the publishing bit is working now?
<dirk>	Beineri: can you add teh bugzilla entry regarding the buildservice bug?
<Beineri>	Bille: dunno, didn't try or talk to mls since last week :-)
<Beineri>	dirk: against cthiel/createrepo? ok
<dirk>	Beineri: "mls" was running around the hallways today and mumbling "this is unsolvable, this is unsolvable.."
<dirk>	Beineri: I'm not sure what he was referring to, though ;)
<Beineri>	will have to check first if there is one already :-)
<Bille>	is there anyone here who wants to get into kde4 development/testing and isn't yet?
<Bille>	if so, talk to me at the end of the meeting.
<dirk>	* Consolidate KDE 4 packaging/build/development instructions 
<dirk>	whats the status, Bille?
<Bille>	no motion, haven't had time
<dirk>	* extend KDE packaging cookbook (
<dirk>	Bille?
<Bille>	same
<Bille>	i'll work on both of those some this week, now RC1 is tagged
<dirk>	* Kamion2
<dirk>	* Package in buildservice
<dirk>	my AI, done (KDE:KDE4)
<dirk>	* Ask author to relicense to GPLV2+ 
<dirk>	my AI, mostly done. Actually it is mostly GPLv2+ already, rest will be solved via the KDE_Relicensing initiative
<Beineri>	dirk: is that the "correct" repo? or only because we have no others yet? :-)
<dirk>	Beineri: it is a KDE4 app, so..
<dirk>	there are two issues: the current upstream maintainer is a bit demotivated because he didn't get user feedback about his app :)
<dirk>	so anyone reading this, try the package and ask him to rock on :-)
<dirk>	the 2nd one is that he is looking for more developers to help
<dirk>	so anyone reading this, feel invited ;)
<dirk>	I already told him that the user base for KDE 4.x is rather small at the moment due the lack of stable releases, and that it will become better in the near future
<Bille>	dirk: what's Kamion 2 about then?
<Bille>	not everyone may be familiar
<dirk>	http://kamion2.sourceforge.net/index.php
<dirk>	Kamion is a user-friendly user state migration and backup tool 
<Bille>	meaning, you can move your KDE installation between machines more easily
<dirk>	if anyone is interested.. talk to me or drop me an email (dirk@kde.org)
<Bille>	dirk: did you give it a try?
<Nix>	oohh..
<dirk>	Bille: not in a real way, no. 
<dirk>	perhaps soon. 
<Nix>	doesn't rsync ~/.kde remote: do migrations just fine? :-)
<Fisiu>	sorry I need to go... airdressing owner has to close businness, anyway if You could give me answer for my Q
<Fisiu>	bye bye
<dirk>	Fisiu: which q?
<Bille>	18:23] <Fisiu> I've got Q abou opensuse kde translation, after applying changes I trunk dir, how long can it take to apply them into update dir?
<dirk>	Nix: yes, but its a bit user unfriendly
<dirk>	Fisiu: drop me an email about which translations where did not get propagated where to exactly, and I'll work on it. (dirk@kde.org)
<dirk>	Nix: I mean, rsync :)
<dirk>	next topic
<dirk>	* b) jambi/qyoto packages
<dirk>	qyoto done, I heard there were problems iwth jambi packages. 
<dirk>	anyone knows the status?
	 * Nix leaves the office for home
<Bille>	dirk: i think you told duncan to check the MDK package and it went quiet
<Bille>	he says he's still having problems building it
<duncanmv>	ok
<duncanmv>	well,  did not tried further
<dirk>	oh, there he is :)
<mii>	Bille: is it?
<duncanmv>	it just does not build, and it requires really black magic to build, the errors where posted in opensuse-factory
<duncanmv>	but nobody has more ideas
<Bille>	mii: this is the opensuse kde meeting
<mii>	k
<dirk>	duncanmv: ok, will you try further? did you ask the czech person who also volunteered for help? asked the jambi mailinglist?
<duncanmv>	no, I did not asked in the mailing list.
<duncanmv>	I will try further yes
<duncanmv>	because if I can't get it running, I will start using mono
<dirk>	duncanmv: :)
<duncanmv>	(which works lke a charm btw)
<dirk>	next topic
<dirk>	Beineri: KDE/Challenges
	 * Beineri started today some scribbling on http://en.opensuse.org/KDE/Challenges
<Beineri>	everything I could think of as targets of future work, not only for openSUSE 11.0
Nick	andred is now known as andred_.
<Beineri>	there is, of course, also a big KDE4 section, which several items we sometime (soon) have to decide (next meeting point)
<Beineri>	s/which/with/
<Bille>	Beineri: that's a good plan btw
<dirk>	Beineri: I like it, quite a good mind map
<apokryphos>	for ' Promoting openSUSE as KDE Development Platform' I'd mention "do more talks": fosdem/akademy
<Beineri>	I don't claim the overall list is complete but it should give already good overview what to discuss during meetings :-)
<dirk>	Beineri: although you should really try that hotel safe for your laptop somewhen ;)
<Beineri>	dirk: it's too small for it
<Beineri>	maybe an eeePC would fit?
<dirk>	definitely!
<dirk>	apokryphos: great idea
<dirk>	apokryphos: we're always uncreative when it comes to actual talk topics though :)
<apokryphos>	several kde developers were distro hopping in the last few weeks and they settled on openSUSE, which is great =)
<Beineri>	apokryphos: we would need a good talk topic quite soon for that then :-|
<Bille>	apokryphos: yep we should capitalise on that and push it
<Bille>	dirk: the workshop format i did at akademy seemed to work quite well for attracting new developers
<Beineri>	so please feel invited to extend this page :-)
<Bille>	and i think the kde4-devel pattern will be good for the old hands, people who are maybe not active at the moment but still personalities, and who would like to be able to install 10.3 and start building kde4 with minimum effort.
<dirk>	apokryphos: I would say that promotion usually works better via blogs though
<apokryphos>	there could be a general talk on kde development in openSUSE: latest kde devel packages to save you compiling all trunk if you're making a kde app, publishing your kde app in the OBS for all popular distros, jambi etc (if it gets done), etc
<dirk>	perhaps we should do a KDE team blogging day or something like that ;)
<apokryphos>	dirk: both are very important; yes, more blogging is definitely very helpful 8)
<apokryphos>	could also talk about status of apps made by the kde team (going upstream)
<Bille>	jpr: you're on the same continent as Marketing - think there is a story in them pushing openSUSE as _the_ linux desktop distribution that does both well, as a contrast to ubuntu and kubuntu's rather difficult relationship?
<apokryphos>	now I'm ripping off my interview with dirk ;)
<Bille>	apokryphos: /me is blogging on that very subject now
<apokryphos>	cool
	 * jpr wakes up and reads back
<dirk>	aha, thats why the discussion is progressing so slowly
<dirk>	Bille is blogging, and dirk is fixing KDE:KDE4 file lists :-)
<dirk>	and Beineri tried that "throwing away laptop" idea ;)
Nick	Beineri_ is now known as Beineri.
<Bille>	i'll do an openSUSE article on Ars when i get a chance too
<Beineri>	dirk: only was away a short moment and closing lid causes resume ;-|
<jpr>	Bille: are you asking if they are pushing such a story (not that I'm aware) or if there is a good story to be made there?
<Beineri>	uhm suspend
<Bille>	jpr: #2
<jpr>	Bille: its certainly not a bad story, i'm uncertain how much it means to people other than those with previous allegiances
<Bille>	jpr: nobody else is using it
<jpr>	no one else really can :-)
<Bille>	and it reflects well on the rest of the distro
<dirk>	jpr: I think more pushing openSUSE strengths over ubuntu would be an effort.. definitley not desktop specific
<dirk>	ok.. anythin left to add for KDE/Challenges?
<Bille>	GPL3
<Bille>	anything to say there yet?
<dirk>	sure
<jpr>	dirk: i agree, we should push the whole thing and say things like hey mandriva people you get all your kde apps and ubuntu people you get all your gnome apps
<jpr>	just the same
<jpr>	:-)
<Bille>	dirk: maybe some blogwords about how novell is being a good citizen and leading the move to licensing compatibility :)
<dirk>	status: there is perhaps a few percent of KDE that is GPLv2 only, but that is being worked on right now
<dirk>	we're not that much affected with GPLv3 incompatibility, given that we tend to do things out of process over services
<dirk>	the Trolltech side is currently being worked on, and they expect to have solved the GPLv3 incompatibility (can't say how yet) by Q1/2008
<dirk>	there is no end of KDE just because of GPLv3 or any other FUD or other crap you might hear elsewhere
<Bille>	is anyone saying that/
<Bille>	outside of the depths of slashdot and heise threads?
<dirk>	sure. Some of them even work for Novell ;)
<dirk>	anyway, I don't think there is a lot more that I can say in public at the moment, other than that is being worked on and all will be fine. 
<apokryphos>	don't worry, boy.com are spreading rumours that gnome is being taken over by MS
<apokryphos>	next item?
<dirk>	c) KDE on 11.0
<dirk>	I think KDE/Challenges covered most of it
<dirk>	Bille, you brought it up: anything you want to say or should we just collect wishes?
<Bille>	dirk: well, i'll be working on 2/3 things for KDE on 11.0
<dirk>	oh really.. 
<dirk>	and I was just twiddling thumbs for 11.0 ;)
<Bille>	1) Kopete integration with Decibel/telepathy
<Beineri>	0.666 things?
<Bille>	dirk: sometimes it's nice to tell people what we have in mind
<Bille>	2) Using Nepomuk for semantic voodoo in Kontact
<Bille>	3) NetworkManager/Solid in KDE4
	 * Beineri actually would prefer to have basic things working first (like config migration :_)
<Beineri>	Kontact config in Bille's case
<Beineri>	and data (mail etc)
<Bille>	Beineri: but those aren't sexay.
<Bille>	the details will have to be dealt with too of course
<Bille>	but those ^^^ are some nice headline features.
<apokryphos>	;-)
<Bille>	apokryphos gets it
<Bille>	Beineri: what have you got in mind?
	 * dirk will work on making KDE 4 a reality on openSUSE 11.0.. reestablishing user experience
<Beineri>	is there anything we can say about KDE4 on 11.0 already today (without talking to/waiting for ProjMgr, ProdMgr, other teams first)?
<dirk>	Beineri: well, not really.
<dirk>	but we can talk about the state
<dirk>	like 
<Bille>	my strategy: of course we do what we do well, get the basics working solidly, not just covered with some fluff like other distros
<Beineri>	Bille: migration voodoo :-)
<Bille>	but we need some fluff too
<dirk>	a) up to date KDE4 packages in the buildservice and in Factory
<dirk>	b) reevaluation of KDE4-as-KDE-default in spring next year, in time for 11.0
<Beineri>	a) we're doing that
<dirk>	c) as always, we need feedback, testing, help, promotion of the new platform to 3rd party app developers
<Beineri>	any opinion about going an "only have kde4 version of app" strategy versus "have/keep both versions"?
	 * Beineri guesses we will not see that much new KDE3 app releases anyway
<Bille>	Beineri: i think kdepim3-enterprise will be in demand for a few years
<dirk>	Beineri: I think we only want to have one version in factory, but provide the other one via the buildservice
<Beineri>	Bille: not talking about the main modules - I guess we will have kde3 modules around for two future releases at least
<Bille>	Beineri: ack
<Beineri>	dirk: so which version would that be? :-)
<Bille>	my expectation is that by 11.0 most leaf apps will be stable and usable.
<Beineri>	dirk: putting all eggs into the "we will kde4 desktop as default" basket?
<Beineri>	+have
<Beineri>	hence switching all application packages from kde3 to kde4 version where possible?
<dirk>	Beineri: well, not all, but it should be a focus
<dirk>	I think 4.0 should be more a focus than 4.1 features (e.g. kopete/decibel) but thats just my opinion
<dirk>	it is time for a change anyway, and KDE4 is getting more beautiful every day :)
<Beineri>	dirk: if not all, which not? the by default installed ones of 10.3 kde3 desktop?
<dirk>	Beineri: I think it is too early to say that.. IMHO we should evaulate after the 4.0 platform release is being done (fingers crossed) and we should proactively contact the interesting application maintainers and ask them about their plans
	 * Beineri actually hopes for a quick 4.1 release so that 11.0 may has 4.1.1 *dreaming*
	 * Bille too
<Beineri>	at least shipping some "intermediate Plasma" which would be obsolete with next release would not leave me comfortable
<Bille>	dirk: good plan
<Beineri>	techbase should have a app roadmap page
<bugbot>	New openSUSE 10.3 (KDE) bug 341681 filed by ragoddard@novell.com.
<bugbot>	Bug https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=341681 Normal, P5 - None, NEW, Kontact Crash (SIGSEGV)
<Bille>	argh
<Bille>	Seli: anything from you?
<Seli>	Bille: oops, I forgot and wasn't paying attention, sorry
<dirk>	I think we should do the KDE on 11.0 AI again next time, together with some spread out action items from KDE/Challenges
	 * dirk has still d) misc on the agenda and not much time left
<Seli>	let me quickly read the backlog
<Bille>	community folks: misc!
<Seli>	Bille: but unless you have specific question, nothing right now
<Bille>	wishes, KDE4 questions, (bugs), pour your hearts out
<Beineri>	one beer for everyone into the cash box from Seli :-)
	 * apokryphos looks forward to the packaging day 8)
<Bille>	so mrdocs mailed the list about getting his krita-plugins package into Backports
<Bille>	turns out it has some features that only work with koffice 1.6.3
<Bille>	so we should pull that into factory
	 * Beineri didn't read that post yet :-)
<Bille>	cyrilleB also has krita-plugins in factory, mrdocs said that he was asked by cyrille to clean the packaging up
<Bille>	mrdocs is also doing a lot of scribus work so we should stay in touch, given that scribus is the shizzle at linux DTP
<Beineri>	wasn't there a koffice 1.6.4 planned? and krita-plugins plugins get rolled back into koffice release anyway?
<dirk>	yes, new koffice release is comming soon
<Bille>	well, you're on more mailing lists than me
<dirk>	I don't know why we have to fork krita plugins, but I haven't read the email Bille got
<Bille>	so is this something that will go away soon
Nick	mw is now known as mw|food.
<Bille>	dirk: was just IRC
<dirk>	okay.. anything.. apokryphos, benJIman ?
<Bille>	enjoy your tacos, mw|food
<dirk>	or anyone else? :)
<apokryphos>	nothing really from me
<apokryphos>	random thought: if someone has extra ITO time with nothing to do, a kde front-end to giver would be nice+probably quite easy 8)
<Beineri>	for my sake create a KDE:Backports/krita-plugins package and enter mrdocs as maintainer only for that
<dirk>	I think we're aiming for the next meeting in the week of November 26th, with the weekday really open still, right?
<apokryphos>	been trying kde4 regularly, happy to test things
<Bille>	dirk: thursday
<dirk>	Bille: so clashing with the gnome meeting? 
<dirk>	I don't particularly care
<Bille>	we can tweak the time. but are there so many with a foot in both camps?
<dirk>	apokryphos: possible.. did you use giver? is the protocol specified somewhere?
<Beineri>	apokryphos: it's a wiki ;-)
<dirk>	Bille: okay, I'll suggest to sort that out tomorrow and announce the next meeting
<dirk>	thats all from me..
<apokryphos>	dirk: not sure, it was a project created by a few gnome guys during hackweek. http://idea.opensuse.org/content/ideas/easy-file-sharing
	 * Beineri is getting hungry...
<apokryphos>	Beineri: hm?
<dirk>	apokryphos: yep, I heard about it.. 
Topic	You set the channel topic to "http://opensuse.org/KDE | http://opensuse.org/KDE/Upgrade | http://opensuse.org/KDE4 | http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-kde/ | KDE 3.5.8/KDE 4.0 beta4 released!".
<Beineri>	apokryphos: add that to KDE/Challenges page as inspiration for random developer
<apokryphos>	will do
<apokryphos>	I'll ping sreeves later to ask about info with the protocol
<dirk>	apokryphos: that would be great. I would really like to have something like that, but I don't want to invent yet another app with yet another proprietary protocol
<apokryphos>	would definitely make sense to use the same protocol
<dirk>	we have enough of those already.. each of them not really moving outside their own sink
<mrdocs>	lo
<mrdocs>	sorry im late :(
	 * mrdocs scrolls back
<Bille>	hi mrdocs
	 * Beineri has no complete log of this meeting btw
<Bille>	dirk, apokryphos: afaics giver is some kind of lightweight task list and groupware
<Bille>	which was written because GW is awful?
<Beineri>	Bille: can you put it up please?
<Bille>	Beineri: Jawohl.
<Beineri>	Bille: Ausführen!
<dirk>	Bille: afaik giver is a file sharing peer2peer app
<Bille>	Zum Abmarsch bereit!
<tpatzig_>	giver just uses http request to transfer fles
<Bille>	oh i thought it was about "giving" people stuff to do.
<apokryphos>	oh, nope
<Bille>	Beineri: see how much german you can learn from playing Day of Defeat? ;)
<dirk>	apokryphos, tpatzig_ : oh, cool, so the frontend is already done: kpf :)
<mrdocs>	 /me logs everything
<dirk>	only the DNS/SD part is missing then
<Bille>	since 1999 or so
<Beineri>	tpatzig_: hi? did you find already new task(s)? :-)
<dirk>	Beineri: I told him about your idea :)
<Bille>	i thought kpf has SLP already...
<Beineri>	dirk: which one? :-)
<dirk>	Beineri: the secret one? ;)
<dirk>	just kidding.. the collaborative editor thingie
<apokryphos>	screenshot of giver at http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fnews.opensuse.org%2F%3Fp%3D341&ei=j0E7R_TgK5iKQu295dQH&usg=AFQjCNH7eW1dJm0bnxW8xySyW_zklpcAAQ&sig2=Ky_igsO1kkyI15asP6bSig
<Bille>	he also has a whiteboard app from hackweek that might be useful
<tpatzig_>	Beineri: yeap as dirk already mentioned..., but (k)iver would also be a great idea ;)
<apokryphos>	oop, http://news.opensuse.org/?p=341
<Beineri>	uhm, yeah. must be so secret that I can't remember atm :-)
<Bille>	Beineri: how's the Harz anyway? much snow?
<apokryphos>	dirk: interesting, I hadn't heard about kpf
	 * Bille imagines Beineri's holiday as being a bit like the Shining
<dirk>	apokryphos: yeah, the fate of every kde app that is not installed by default ;(
<apokryphos>	oh wait, yeah, I know that. Giver is just so nice and easy though 8)
<Beineri>	Bille: it's snowing but now staying in this village (too low)
<Bille>	Beineri: same here
<apokryphos>	with giver you automatically get an entry for people running it on the network, and you just drag files to them
<Beineri>	s/now/not/
<tpatzig_>	apokryphos: just a zerconf/avahi feature
<Bille>	what's the file xfer? http?
<tpatzig_>	but really cool ;)
<tpatzig_>	Bille: yeah http
	 * Beineri goes looking if some food is left...
<Bille>	so, i'll be around for another hour or so
<Bille>	if anyone wants to get their feet wet wtih kde 4
<dirk>	apokryphos: yep, so basically you're asking for DNS/SD support for kpf. that should be really cool and easy to do. 
	 * dirk eyes that tpatzig could look into that :)
<Bille>	dirk: can remote:/ do that already?
<Bille>	that's what zeroconf:/ is, right?
<benJIman>	Firewall will block it by default.
<dirk>	benJIman: true, but its neat anyway for workgroun environments
<dirk>	anyway, I'm off.. see ya
	 * Bille thinks of a good kde frontend name for a rebranded kpf - giver, kiver, kiffer?
<dirk>	Bille: I don't think we need gnome names as inspiration, do we ?
<Bille>	but they have glipper!
<Bille>	"Kiffer - it's good to share"