Started at --> 00 suseROCKs: whew... captain_magnus is here.. otherwise we'd really be ticked off hehe jpr: Welcome to the first openSUSE GNOME Meeting of 2008! jpr: we had a great 2007, especially from mid-August on suseROCKs: it's 2008??? Man where'd the time go? jpr: really crunching bugs jpr: putting out a great 10.3 jpr: and continuing on to 11.0 which is well in progress now jpr: so thanks everyone for a job well done jpr: and here's to an even better 2008

Started at --> 00 ** captain_magnus raises his glas... FunkyGeeko: what did i miss? jpr: federico1: take it away jpr: FunkyGeeko: just a brief intro :-) federico1: ok federico1: we had the Main Menu Bug Fixing Week on the week of Dec 17-21 federico1: thanks to all the people that helped test patches and make new patches :) federico1: there is still some pending work at http://en.opensuse.org/GNOME/Main_menu_bug_week federico1: most notably, we have to review some new patches, and integrate all the final ones into our 10.3 / 11.0 package federico1: as well as put out a new release tarball for upstream federico1: sreeves has been working on integrating everything we have upstream, to avoid diverging... we had a little bunch of branches which are fortunately getting in sync now rodrigo: sreeves, federico1: we still need to find out what's in the tiles-2 branch, right? federico1: the bug list for main-menu is still long, but I think we made good progress on the basic behavior issues. captain_magnus is working on performance as well federico1: rodrigo: yeah :) rodrigo: ok sreeves: yes, our next release will be from trunk which will contain the merges from all the branches except the expermental tiles-2 branch jpr: sreeves: when will that be? rodrigo: with gnome 2.21.x I guess? sreeves: there a still a couple of issues with some of the patches we need to resolve first jpr: so with in a couple of weeks say? sreeves: yeah jpr: federico1: any thoughts on the next topic and next time for a bug week ? federico1: sreeves: let's fix up the patches next week, except for tiles-2 federico1: I want to finish my pending stuff from last year :) federico1: jpr: yeah, I was thinking about the multiscreen stuff, which can be easily parallelized jpr: federico1: any proposed date? federico1: jpr: I can patch GdkScreen to do the right thing, and put out instructions for people who want to fix up apps which do their own thing federico1: jpr: not next week, but the one after that? federico1: then I want to have a file chooser week at some point suseROCKs: federico1, i just remembered there was an m-m/orca bug that I filed. Did that get tackled? jpr: AI: federico1 to propose date and organize multiscreen hackfest jpr: federico1: anything else to add? sreeves: federico1: would that be a 11.0 project ? federico1: suseROCKs: nope, not yet - I need to get my a11y setup fixed :) federico1: jpr: nothing other that I'm really itching to see captain_magnus's patches integrated :) ** suseROCKs pokes federico1's eyes out to make him a11y-able jpr: ok :-)

Started at --> 00 federico1: sreeves: the stuff for next week? jpr: sreeves: you're up! sreeves: federico1: yeah, the multiscreen stuff -would that be going into 10.3 federico1: ah sreeves: ok - so factory testing... federico1: sreeves: we'd at least release the fixes for gdm and the panel, I guess... the "panel position is screwed on my intel graphics laptop" federico1: sreeves: everything else for 11.0 sreeves: federico1: cool sreeves: so factory is far enough along now that we can do some decent testing on it federico1: oops suseROCKs: umm actually no federico1: jpr: one last thing - Jan 14-18 for bug week intersects my estimated birth date :) sreeves: for pretty decent instructions on how to get there see - http://en.opensuse.org/Factory jpr: federico1: well, you have to do some planning then :-) suseROCKs: captain_magnus, and I have both encountered that gnome won't install with 11.0 sreeves: however be warned of course - it is in significant flux federico1: you expect me to *think* at this hour? :) jpr: lets wait for scott to finish :-) jpr: sreeves: plough on sreeves: I would recomend testing this in a vm or on a box you don't mind completely redoing quite often sreeves: suseROCKs: hrmm, what were the issues captain_magnus: But the GNOME pattern is not installable due to dependency issues and have not been for some time now... suseROCKs: when we get to software installation, there were dependency issues captain_magnus: And there are not a lot of GNOME commits going into Factory... btimothy: i hit a strange gnome-keyring problem yesterday trying to run updates on factory ... is that what you're talking abt.? captain_magnus: Yes jpr: that bug was reported by casual j. programmer and the fix submitted suseROCKs: a version of 11.0 about a month ago did work, but I think it stopped working about 2 weeks ago. sreeves: jpr and mw|screen and others are working on rolling gnome 2.21 into factory sreeves: jpr: how is that going jpr: its going, according to the spreadsheet most of 2.21.4 is done captain_magnus: jpr: Done as in Factory? jpr: yes jpr: at least submitted there jpr: if not built and synced yet captain_magnus: Why doesn't that show up on the -commit ml if that's the case? captain_magnus: I was told that everything that goes into Factory will show up on -commit... jpr: maybe its not been committed to factory even though its been submitted sreeves: we also have some nice updates like NM 0.7 that will roll in here shortly (week or so) jpr: or maybe i underestimate what mw|screen submitted captain_magnus: Ok.. Guess we'll wait for mw to come online and ask him... jpr: sreeves: anything else to add? sreeves: I think thats it jpr: ok jpr: as one last note jpr: if factory is not upgradeable for dep issues and such jpr: *please* report them jpr: as gnome-showstopper type bugs

Started at --> 00 btimothy: http://www.rememberthemilk.com/home/opensuse.gnome/1884064/#section.tasks btimothy: as stated in the agenda, we'd (captain_magnus and i) would like to propose moving to this system for managing our tasks btimothy: btw, everything in bold on that page is due today or overdue btimothy: any objections (would require most of you to create accounts on rememberthemilk.com captain_magnus: +1 to test this for a month or so and the re-evaluate suseROCKs: who cleans out the task list? btimothy: i agree. i'd like to see us try it out at least rodrigo: yes, right now I'd prefer bugzilla, so testing it for a bit sounds good captain_magnus: suseROCKs: The task owner... So you register with RTM and then when you have a completed task, you just mark it completed jpr: rodrigo read my mind btimothy: AI: for everyone ... go create accounts on RTM and mail captaim_magnus or me and we'll hook you up jpr: bugzilla seems to have some of the functionality we want jpr: ok captain_magnus: Problem with bugzilla: The 5 minut login :-( btimothy: okay, so as far as tasks go... btimothy: federico1, rodrigo: can we close our the bug categorization task? srag: Hello everyone... srag: sorry to be late ** psankar considers filing a enhancement bug on bnc for option: "Remember me on this computer forever" btimothy: munkii isn't around ... rodrigo, federico1, do you have what you need from munkii as far as bug categorization? federico1: btimothy: yes, unless you want to mark them as ongoing btimothy: federico1: i'll move that one to an ongoing item federico1: btimothy: oh, yeah - I don't think munkii's task was well specified btimothy: federico1: munkii's tasks ... not really needed anymore? btimothy: suseROCKs: tracker bug for a11y? suseROCKs: btimothy, that task has been dropped. btimothy: suseROCKs: k, thanks suseROCKs: we already have keywoard gnome-accessibility search federico1: btimothy: yes, not needed anymore rodrigo: btimothy: I guess it's not needed anymore, if we find new categories, we can add them as part of the ongoing task btimothy: jpr: schwag organization? btimothy: federico1, rodrigo: thanks jpr: btimothy: waiting until .de comes back next week jpr: although martin did seem to be in this week btimothy: jpr: postpone 'til next mtg.? jpr: yes btimothy: jpr: k btimothy: rodrigo: ETA on PulseAudio? rodrigo: btimothy: should be done between today and tomorrow btimothy: rodrigo: okay, once you have a RTM account, will you please update the ETA on your task? rodrigo: yes btimothy: cool :) btimothy: okay, any volunteers to pick up these unassigned tasks? btimothy: testopia, gilouche theme, more info on the submitting bugs page ? suseROCKs: btimothy, if I am looking at the rtm link you sent us, how do we determine from that list which are unassigned? btimothy: suseROCKs: if you log in as yourself, it works a little better suseROCKs: ah btimothy: if you hover over the item, you'll see in the tags section on the right who it's assigned to captain_magnus: suseROCKs: Move your mouse over each task and look at the window to the right... Or better yet, login and you will get a nice tag cloud... :-) suseROCKs: always a gotcha jpr: btimothy: gilouche should just go to mw, he's working with jimmac on an update btimothy: jpr: k ** suseROCKs thinks captain_magnus is obsessed with tag clouds btimothy: so as far as the email notification from the wiki task ... btimothy: they did enable some sort of notification btimothy: i'm mostly displeased with its implementation btimothy: i was hoping for something like what live.gnome.org has btimothy: but i don't htink that's possible with this wiki btimothy: anyone using the email notification for en.opensuse.org ... and find it at all useful? jpr: are we using mediawiki? btimothy: i think i'm gonna have to just drop that task for now btimothy: yes, mediawiki suseROCKs: I thought it was drupal? federico1: btimothy: what, it works now? I'm subscribed to a few pages, but have never gotten notified captain_magnus: Same here btimothy: federico1: it's entirely lame btimothy: i think it only notifies you the first time someone else changes it after you've modified the page btimothy: like i said, their implementation bites ivanz: Is someone here using Evolution by any chance? I would like to know if I can make it keep a copy of sent reply mails in the folder of the original mail so I can have it in the threads? btimothy: ...not the wiki maintainer's fault. it's the email plugin for the wiki that sucks captain_magnus: ivanz: In the middle of a meeting... ivanz: ops sorry I just woke up ivanz: :) jpr: ivanz: at Q&A time though, the evo guys are here :-) btimothy: anyhow ... so that's abt. it for tasks ... just remember to ... psankar: ivanz, not possible atm. btimothy: sign up for RTM account btimothy: and mail captain_magnus or me with your username btimothy: so we can associate you with this task list btimothy: and also ... btimothy: add status updates by adding notes to the task federico1: btimothy: hmmmmm, I'm 80% sure that I set up a mail notification thing for a mediawiki site once and it worked as expected btimothy: we'll give it a whirl for a month and re-evaluate btimothy: federico1: i can look into it again federico1: as in I'm 100% sure I set it up, and 80% sure that it worked as expected :) suseROCKs: I really thought our wiki was drupal and not mediawiki srag: ivanz, file a bug if one is not there already btimothy: suseROCKs: i'll look into that too :) btimothy: hpj: any last words abt. the code repo task? btimothy: drop that task for now? btimothy: other than that, i think we can move on btimothy: thanks everyone suseROCKs: I think we have to wake him up first  :-)

Started at --> 00 jpr: ok jpr: so this is I think the 3rd Asia/Australia meeting jpr: the question is jpr: is it useful to have them jpr: keep having them that is suseROCKs: Keep the Australians? Hmm... jpr: hopefully someone from india, china or australia speaks up now :-) captain_magnus: I'm neutral... btimothy: in that case, -1 from me btimothy: (sorry) jpr: for reference at our regular time jpr: its 4am in australia jpr: 1am in china btimothy: right :( suseROCKs: truth be told, I'm not working these days, so scheduling is no problem for me. But when I'm working again, the 11 a.m. normal time won't be good for me in the U.S. jpr: and 10:30pm in india chen_: am ok with any time - 6:10 PM in india right now chen_: 10:30 seems ok for me suseROCKs: so these early morning Australian times are beneficial for U.S. volunteers who work. chen_: psankar, srag ? jpr: DavidLiang, flex: opinion? ** FunkyPenguin prefers this time psankar: anytime will be okay with me FunkyPenguin: not that i count :) captain_magnus: Looks like we can scrap it and have it at the same time every week... DavidLiang: 10:30 is ok for me DavidLiang: 1am is OK jpr: DavidLiang: well for you 10:30am in india is 1am :-) srag: jpr, some how 10.30pm is more convenient than 5.30pm srag: it is just after the office hours and enters into the peak traffic hours by the time the meeting ends DavidLiang: I'm fine with anytime, but flex has a new born baby.. haha suseROCKs: question.. I notice captain_magnus is active on here during, what would be 5 p.m. chicago time... Would that hour be more convenient for us all? srag: though I'm fine with any time jpr: suseROCKs: if the EU wants to stay up late :-) suseROCKs: I thought we didn't care about the EU? rodrigo: that's midnight here, so it's ok for me also ** suseROCKs ducks ** lejo_ hits suseROCKs with a Eiffel tower rodrigo: :) ** rodrigo helps lejo_ jpr: its also like 2:30 am in india or something ** FunkyPenguin passes big ben jpr: so jpr: we are going in circles jpr: how about this jpr: as a statement for voting jpr: "should we continue to try and time shift one meeting a month to help get participation from india, china and australia" jpr: the time we will figure out if we have to captain_magnus: +-0 rodrigo: +1 suseROCKs: I'd like to amend question... srag: +1 DavidLiang: +0 chen_: +0 jpr: and I want to see flex, DavidLiang, psankar, srag, etc all vote :-) suseROCKs: never mind... don't know what I was bout to say at this hour  :-) +0 captain_magnus: srag: Thought you didn't want the meeting at this time? lakhil: +1 psankar: +0 srag: captain_magnus, Hmm I would like to move from 5.30 to 4.30 or so srag: so that it is more convenient :) FunkyPenguin: +1 federico1: -1 btimothy: -1 jpr: ok suseROCKs: srag, just so I understand... is it 5:30 now over there?? FunkyPenguin: jpr what's your view? jpr: well i was for shifting psankar: suseROCKs, it started at 5:30 and now is 6:20 srag: it is 6.30 now jpr: but DavidLiang, captain_magnus the two most affected are neutral suseROCKs: holy crap... that means federico1 and I would be up at 4 a.m.! jpr: so i'm less certain FunkyPenguin: looks like +4 -2 with out your vote jpr: i propose the following btimothy: come on sreeves let's see a vote from you  ;) jpr: AI: srag, DavidLiang, captain_magnus discuss possible alternate shift times and value jpr: how does that sound? srag: I would like to prepone the time by 1 hour jpr: srag: not this second :-) jpr: srag: outside the meeting srag: oh ok :) captain_magnus: Yeah, works for me jpr: done jpr: come back with a proposal in a week or two :-) jpr: DavidLiang: good for you? DavidLiang: YES jpr: flex: or you if you'd like to participate as well jpr: ok

Started at --> 00 ** captain_magnus is away for two weeks starting Sunday... But will try to give some input before that jpr: questions ! suseROCKs: captain_magnus, how convenient  :-) captain_magnus: suseROCKs: That's not a question ivanz: Can I ask a few things about Evolution now ? :) suseROCKs: ok I have a topic I'd like to discuss... but not sure if its related to us sreeves: ivanz: go for it ivanz: So can I change the Trash and Spam folders for an IMAP account ? psankar: ivanz, nope. you cannot. suseROCKs: I'm getting a little irked lately by seeing more and more articles on places like lxer talk about uubuntu or rh and we're getting more and more unnoticed. Anything we can do to re-boost our presence out there? ivanz: also I want to hide all fileds (to, from subject) from preview but it seems that if I untick all it ignores me psankar: ivanz, I donot know if it will work. jsut try adding a dummy filed say "XYZ" and enable that alone ** psankar tries it lejo_: i also have a groupwise issue with evo (347158) very annoying since we use groupwise at a lot of customers jpr: suseROCKs: i suggest taking that to the project mailing list ivanz: meh I field a bug about my thread thing psankar: ivanz, yes it works. add a dummy header and tick that alone suseROCKs: jpr ok federico1: on that note, we are on the final stages of picking a community evangelist (people have been interviewed for the position, etc.) - so we'll have someone to kick some media asses soon captain_magnus: What's happening with Conduit? Did we drop that for 10.3 as it was not stable and were we suppose to get that going in 11.0? suseROCKs: I'm thinking about interviewing someone for my blog. Who here is itching to get their work known publicly? jpr: captain_magnus: it was checked in by mw to 11.0 jpr: captain_magnus: its also available for 10.3 in mw's BS repo captain_magnus: Cool... Will play with it and see how it goes :-) jpr: its sweet captain_magnus: Who decided the current GNOME Standard Desktop Pattern in openSUSE? jpr: mostly me and gekker i think jpr: tweaking ones from way back captain_magnus: Ok... It'd be great if we could have a discussion about it in one of these meetings (what should be included/excluded) captain_magnus: Would that be possible? jpr: sure jpr: AI: schedule review of gnome related patterns (jpr) jpr: any other q's? sreeves: +1 for pattern review rodrigo: yes, very convenient for pulseaudio integration jpr: ok

Started at --> 00 jpr: so jpr: our 10.3 update got punted before christmas jpr: I'd like to restart this jpr: and target Jan 10 jpr: as the submission date to 10.3-Update ** jpr gives a little background jpr: to get some extra testing jpr: mw is going to setup jpr: GNOME:10.3-Test or something similar jpr: because this is a largish but non-critical update jpr: (our own patch tuesday!) jpr: we have a number of fixes queued jpr: for the greeter, beagle, f-spot jpr: main menu jpr: etc jpr: so it would be great if everyone here could test the fixes jpr: when they are built in the next couple of days rodrigo: is there any other bug we should look at fixing? jpr: (I'll mail the list) captain_magnus: Sounds great apart from one little detail... With the openSUSE GNOME updater, you wont know what's being patches (or it is hard to say the least) so after patching, how to know what to test...? suseROCKs: I'll be glad to do that. Just let me know when to start installing them to a test box jpr: captain_magnus: for this you'll need to subscribe to a repo with packages only rodrigo: captain_magnus: you can press 'details' and see what's going to be updated jpr: so zypper update -r GNOME:10.3-Test captain_magnus: jpr: Ah, fair enough jpr: should do the trick Iznogood: no suseROCKs: captain_magnus, I always select details, Never accept updates blindly (no pun intended) jpr: i'll also publish a list of the fixes Iznogood: zypper up -t packages -r GNOME:10.3-Test jpr: Iznogood: ah, good catch :-) Iznogood: ypper up -t package -r GNOME:10.3-Test Iznogood: sorry drop the s on packages :) jpr: this update is not for critical issues jpr: like the intel panel/gdm bug jpr: that should still be done separately ** federico1 twiddles jpr: and after we test it will still go to the opensuse test update channel jpr: do people know about that channel? captain_magnus: yup rodrigo: yes ** captain_magnus updates "blindly" from that channel... jpr: ok suseROCKs: I do now jpr: great jpr: so, let me know if you have any candidate bugs that are fixed jpr: and just need pushing

Started at --> 00 jpr: of course I don't recall hearing from hpj today jpr: hmm jpr: ok jpr: rodrigo: pulse audio? rodrigo: as I said before, should be done by tomorrow rodrigo: except for the patterns thing, which I guess can wait for the discussion jpr: rodrigo: should probably attempt to fix pattern ahead of time rodrigo: ok jpr: for the next alpha jpr: sreeves, captain_magnus , federico1 : main menu ? federico1: jpr: we'll fix up the remaining patches next week jpr: federico1: when can we expect all the goodness in factory? federico1: jpr: next week sounds pretty doable; it's just some patch review. Should we also make a 10.3 package? federico1: or I can just put the 10.3 one in my repo jpr: your guys call :-) jpr: sreeves, btimothy : PackageKit ? jpr: suseROCKs: a11y? captain_magnus: I think all the patches are to intrusive for a 10.3 update btimothy: well ... haven't really touched packagekit since before my mini hack week on tomboy (http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=2159178717&size=o) btimothy: but ... suseROCKs: jpr nothing really to report on a11y. HPJ did an accerciser build for 11.0, but I haven't been able to test it since alpha won't let me install gnome btimothy: jpr and i were talking a little bit about it yesterday ... btimothy: i'm held up on development because a new policykit is required jpr: suseROCKs: i can get you a package to work around that i think btimothy: which doesn't really run in 10.3 yet btimothy: and updating to factory right now is busted btimothy: i'll try again today jpr: btimothy: i mailed Duncan, he's out to next week - should we keep moving on with other things for now? suseROCKs: jpr ok cuz I'm itchin' to testin' btimothy: in any case, we need to have a discussion with duncan for next steps btimothy: of where to go with packagekit btimothy: since proof-of-concept has been done btimothy: it's just a poor implementation (my fault) Iznogood: btw is rpm5 going into factory? if it does, I guess that will impact packagkit too, no? btimothy: ...and partly the fact that libzypp doesn't really have a decent API for doing things like this jpr: Iznogood: won't impact directly since we use zypp jpr: btimothy: ok jpr: federico1: can we cross the avahi item off as done? jpr: federico1: http://en.opensuse.org/GNOME/Ideas/11.0#Avahi btimothy: jpr: and yes, i should probably move on to something else in the meantime until factory at least has settled jpr: ok btimothy: jpr: suggestions? suseROCKs: anybody here an exerpt on old modem technologies? jpr: btimothy: lets talk after ** btimothy agrees federico1: jpr: oh, yeah! jpr: cool federico1: jpr: maybe we can later have some automagic integration... "show all my .local machines in the nautilus network", etc. jpr: federico1: nautilus already shows ssh availability :-) jpr: in the network browser jpr: via avahi federico1: suseROCKs: atz atdt56436634 baby jpr: ok ** captain_magnus think nautilus should show bluetooth devices as well... suseROCKs: federico1, not sure what you said, but I'll take it you're saying you're an expert. we'll talk after the meeting  :-) Iznogood: +1

Started at --> 00 jpr: ok jpr: other questions? suseROCKs: oops... I thought we WERE in Dev Q&A my mistake for posting too soon. suseROCKs: Has anyone looked at the Ideas a11y section? ** rodrigo looks suseROCKs: Some of those, I think, are not that technically difficult to achieve, especially the hearing-impaired ones. rodrigo: suseROCKs: btw, we are integrating mousetweaks into control-center for 2.22 suseROCKs: I'd like to see how we can get at least some "hearing impaired" accessibility integrated in 11.0 and slow down the flow of deaf community going to OSX instead. suseROCKs: rodrigo, explain mousetweaks  :-) jpr: for after the meeting :-) rodrigo: it's for configuring mouse gestures jpr: any other questions? suseROCKs: rodrigo, thanks rodrigo: suseROCKs: see all the mousetweaks threads in http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnomecc-list/2007-November/thread.html rodrigo: suseROCKs: and http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnomecc-list/2007-November/thread.html rodrigo: sorry, http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnomecc-list/2007-October/thread.html Meeting ended at --> 00

• AI: federico1 to propose date and organize multiscreen hackfest
• AI: for everyone ... go create accounts on RTM and mail captaim_magnus or me and we'll hook you up
• AI: srag, DavidLiang, captain_magnus discuss possible alternate shift times and value
• AI: schedule review of gnome related patterns (jpr)