Education/Meetings/Education Meeting 2009-06-02/transcript

<kl_eisbaer> equal - if nobody likes, let's start our openSUSE-Education meeting :-) <kl_eisbaer> Please have a look at http://en.opensuse.org/Education/Meetings/Education Meeting 2009-08-26 for details

<kl_eisbaer> We've still some bugs open, even in devzilla and bnc, but none of those bugs is a blocker atm <kl_eisbaer> so for me openSUSE-Education 1.0 is FINISHED for 10.2 - 11.1 and SLE10 <kl_eisbaer> A last interesting topic is an extra version for SLE11 <kl_eisbaer> should we also create an add-on for SLE11 or not? <kl_eisbaer> our OBS project already builds for SLE11, so for me it looks like we "just" need someone who has a look at the missing dependencies (SDL for example) and produce the add-on the "old way" <kl_eisbaer> so I like the idea still providing an add-on for released openSUSE based products <kl_eisbaer> but if our team decides that we should focus on OBS created products (like the li-f-e media), it's also ok with me <kl_eisbaer> what do you think? <The_Code> how many SLE10 add-ons are in use, is there a number? <kl_eisbaer> well current y <kl_eisbaer> ups <kl_eisbaer> I can have a look at the downloads, yes <kl_eisbaer> but - for example - the HP-"Deal" includes openSUSE-Education packages for SLE10 already <kl_eisbaer> and they are preinstalled on the hardware <kl_eisbaer> so we should get some numbers from HP (but I bet they won't share them with us) <The_Code> ok, so it is somehow an important part <aochs_> use anyone the SLE 11 in School and need the EDU-Projekt? <The_Code> then we should also have it for SLE11 <kl_eisbaer> ok - so I'll take the AI to create an SLE11 add-on <kl_eisbaer> BTW: my logfiles count 650 downloads for openSUSE-Education-1.0-for-SLE10.iso <The_Code> good :) <kl_eisbaer> any other points for topic 1

<kl_eisbaer> The_Code? <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg? <The_Code> nothing new from my side <kl_eisbaer> news from this topic? <kl_eisbaer> so it looks like we skip this topic <cyberorg> sorry, was away a bit, updated li-f-e DVD, having a workshop on 29th, will be giving out dvds to all participants <cyberorg> someone from http://dqweek.ciol.com/ interviewed me today, so hopefully they will write about it soon :) <cyberorg> about branding, 11.1 is complete, we'll(with Sam) start work on 11.2 li-f-e <kl_eisbaer> Does this mean: new wallpapers or do you re-use the "old" ones <cyberorg> we'll try to do complete new look for 11.2 <kl_eisbaer> any ETA? <cyberorg> when we start building images based on 11.2 :) <The_Code> http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Tw4llJhbLb8BZN61HpspbQ?feat=directlink <aochs_> cyberorg: why do you create a new look <aochs_> ? <The_Code> i printed two images i found in edu-svn as poster fro FrOSCon <kl_eisbaer> BTW: 1424 downloads for openSUSE-Education-1.0-for-11.0.iso ;-) <cyberorg> aochs_, just to keep it fresh and different when people try 11.2 <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, is there way to get stats about downloads from oBS repo? <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: no, stats are disabled since a long time - and nobody at suse has the time to fix and re-enable it <cyberorg> may be sam can fix it if someone shows him what is needed <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: ping adrian at #opensuse-buildservice <kl_eisbaer> and/or tell sam to subscribe to opensuse-buildservice@opensuse.org <cyberorg> ok, i'll ask him when he comes to my office again <kl_eisbaer> any other ideas for the branding status?

<kl_eisbaer> I've the following 3 events listed: <kl_eisbaer>* openSUSE Community Week <kl_eisbaer>* FOSDEM <kl_eisbaer>* FROSCOM <kl_eisbaer> I think the people attending this events should write a short "summary" to opensuse-edu@opensuse.org <kl_eisbaer> what do you think? <The_Code> kl_eisbaer, FROSCOM == FrOSCon ? <kl_eisbaer> Ähe - jup ;-) <The_Code> and what about LinuxTag <nubae_> meet now? <kl_eisbaer> Not listed so far... <kl_eisbaer> fixed <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: yes - welcome <nubae_> cool, remembered correctly then <The_Code> i am currently working on a blog post about the overall FrOSCon for openSUSE and will write a special edu summary as well <nubae_> i've been pretty absent from contributing... works unfortunately taken a front line... but I did manage to code a python educational app <kl_eisbaer> The_Code: ok - added your blog post and summary as AI ;-) <The_Code> kl_eisbaer, also add as my AI aggregate opensuse-education.org news to planetsuse <The_Code> that one is back from linuxtag <kl_eisbaer> The_Code: http://www.opensuse-education.org/index.php?module=pagesetter&func=xmllist&tid=1&tpl=RSS <nubae_> its called pyclic and its quite simple... oh we have a launchpad page explaining it: <nubae_> https://launchpad.net/pyclic <The_Code> kl_eisbaer, thx <kl_eisbaer> => you can use http://www.opensuse-education.org/rss-news.php - it's shorter <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: looks like we need a package for openSUSE ;-) <nubae_> in terms of more opensuse specific stuff... a user is translating all the stuff to German of linux-for-education <kl_eisbaer> What I like to add to the current topic: the "summaries" should contain some information about "bad" things and possible ideas to make them better for next events <nubae_> and I'm working on a howto beautify/jazz up a base opensuse-edu install... basically it ends up looking a little like a mac interface... using cairodock for bottom panel <nubae_> is there anything else that is urgently needed for linux-for-education? <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: sounds interesting <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: I'm still thinking about localisation <kl_eisbaer> I've some german teachers who know their language and like to provide some course material <nubae_> yeah... we need to decide how that is to be done from a menu perspective <kl_eisbaer> but they are not good english speakers (they've learned russian in their school time...) <nubae_> or maybe we should just duplicate the entire thing? <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: do you know if moodle has some options to enable language specific menus/settings, etc.? <nubae_> there is still a real barrier for teachers to create courses it seems, maybe we need another howto... maybe even a video showing how to make / upload courses <kl_eisbaer> in the easiest way like on opensuse-education.org with a menu for each language <nubae_> yeah, but not from a content perspective... what I mean is... <nubae_> u get the choose a language, which translates the entire ui, but the way the course sections are layed out stay the same of course <nubae_> so maybe we need a toplevel <kl_eisbaer> hm: maybe <nubae_> that is just English / Deutsch / Español or something <kl_eisbaer> looks like a good idea <kl_eisbaer> even as other languages have maybe other course areas <nubae_> exactly <nubae_> what about the video screencast idea? <kl_eisbaer> not sure, I know the Ubuntu screencasts <kl_eisbaer> if that doesn't bother you from other things, it's welcome <nubae_> well, my time is limited of course, so whatever is most important :-) <kl_eisbaer> but the most important things are "publicity and content" for me <nubae_> There haven't been many other volunteers coming to the table... just the one guy I believe u sent my way <kl_eisbaer> if the time to produce a screencast can be spended to produce 2 normal courses... <nubae_> it can for sure <kl_eisbaer> We've two teachers here in germany waiting.... <nubae_> but the question is... by making a screencast, can we get more people to create courses? <kl_eisbaer> (comming from Seminarix, which is based on Sidux, based on Debian....) <nubae_> ok... so what do they need? <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: ask OpenOffice people <kl_eisbaer> I think a small, but effective team is better than people just saying "I like to contribute" <kl_eisbaer> We've already a lot of users, but not so much contributions <nubae_> yeah, how do we motivate them to become helpers? <kl_eisbaer> So let's work on the content and (as openSUSE-Education shows) if we've the right content "on board", the rest will follow <kl_eisbaer> motivation == publicity <nubae_> ok.... well I guess courses like, the perfect opensuse desktop and courses of its nature work quite well <kl_eisbaer> perhaps we can think about the "Online Course of the month", but that's something for later, if we've more than one or two contributors ;-) <nubae_> thats why I want to make another one that makes opensuse-edu look 'really cool', with a mac like interface <nubae_> not a bad idea... course of the month would cause some pride for the creators <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: think about news on news.opensuse.org or in topics around openSUSE pointing to courses from Linux-for-education.org ... <nubae_> yeah, more links to l-for-e would be good for sure <nubae_> maybe some net marketing... submission to search engines, etc <kl_eisbaer> We can - for example - patch the initial "Welcome" screen displayed to new openSUSE users after their first log in <nubae_> yeah thats would be good <kl_eisbaer> to link linux-for-education.org as starting point for their learning experience <kl_eisbaer> ^^ net marketing... submission to search engines <= absolutely <nubae_> eespecially since the first thing they are likely to do is either follow the perfect opensuse-edu desktop or the make it look like a mac desktop courses <kl_eisbaer> this would be something for our next Li-f-e media for example <kl_eisbaer> jip <kl_eisbaer> So how many Action items do we have now - and who likes to take them? <kl_eisbaer> submission to search engines => AI: nubae <nubae_> have u seen some cairodock screenshots? <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, can be get li-f-e and edu addon listed on http://software.opensuse.org/ ? <kl_eisbaer> net marketing => AI: nubae, lars <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: => http://features.opensuse.org/ please <cyberorg> and linux-for-education.org linked from http://www.opensuse.org/en/ ? <kl_eisbaer> net marketing => AI: nubae, lars, cyberorg <nubae_> here is an example of cairo-dock: <The_Code> after the discussion with the fsfe guys at FrOSCon maybe they also want to link <kl_eisbaer> localisation of linux-for-education.org => nubae ? <nubae_> I'm seeing a lot of nubaes there :-p <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: me too :-) <The_Code> i will take the real life marketing AI <The_Code> for germany <kl_eisbaer> patched welcome screen for li-f-e media => AI: ? <kl_eisbaer> The_Code? Lars? <The_Code> you mean this first window that opens after intall -> login? <The_Code> that's mono, i think => my AI <kl_eisbaer> ok, thanks <nubae_> oh... <nubae_> nubae_ is now a opensuse member <nubae_> got an email confirming :-) <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: welcome ;-) <kl_eisbaer> so - what about the openSUSE Conference? <kl_eisbaer> Anyone who likes to participate ? <nubae_> kl_eisbaer, which one? <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: openSUSE Conference, 17-20. Sept. 2009 in Nuernberg <nubae_> hmmm.... wonder how I can convince my work to pay for it :p <The_Code> i will be there <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: just take your vacation - nuernberg is a beautiful town to visit ;-) <The_Code> and i think kl_eisbaer and i have a workshop <kl_eisbaer> The_Code: psst ;-) <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, https://features.opensuse.org/307518 <kl_eisbaer> But good to remember me to ping zonker agian <The_Code> kl_eisbaer, that was, what i was up to <nubae_> I can ask for sure... my work does encourage going to linux based events so... <The_Code> nubae_, it will be a great event and nuremberg is worth a visit <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: voted <nubae_> hmmm... maybe I can say I'm promoting my new edu app :-p <The_Code> voted too <kl_eisbaer> any other events, we need to take care about? <The_Code> i just decided to go to open rhein ruhr in november to man the opensuse booth, so will be promoting openSUSE education there as well <nubae_> cyberorg, anything need doing with sugar? <kl_eisbaer> The_Code: news submitted? <nubae_> Should we take a look at updating honey apps? <The_Code> news? <nubae_> adding some new ones... like the physics activity <cyberorg> nubae_, not sure, you can test 0.85 packages alsroot has been building <cyberorg> yup updating all the activities would be good <nubae_> ok, hes not building honey though <nubae_> ok... I'll task that <nubae_> too <nubae_> :p <cyberorg> also have a look at the latest li-f-e DVD to see if all of sugar is in working order <nubae_> yup, ok <cyberorg> thanks :) <The_Code> kl_eisbaer, what did you mean? <kl_eisbaer> The_Code: add the event in the event calendar on news.opensuse.org <The_Code> kl_eisbaer, how do i do that? <nubae_> maybe we could script a news item to be written every time a new course is added? <nubae_> that would bring some publicity <kl_eisbaer> The_Code: two ways: 1) send your announcement to me or 2) read http://news.opensuse.org/how-to-contribute/ and do it directly ;-) <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: yes, good idea <kl_eisbaer> I like to proceed with topic 4 - if there are no vetos? <The_Code> kl_eisbaer, ok reading

<nubae_> there were some? <kl_eisbaer> SLEducator: can you tell us something about the openSIS-MySQL GSoC status? <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: see http://en.opensuse.org/Education/Meetings/Education_Meeting_2009-08-2 <kl_eisbaer> does someone know anything about the YaST education module ? <nubae_> i heard/read it got dropped <nubae_> I dont know where I read that <The_Code> jeff dropped it <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: opensuse-edu maybe <The_Code> he said he might have it finished mid september <The_Code> i don't know anything else <The_Code> somebody should ask jeff where his sources are, we could get them in edu svn so somebody might be able to finish/help with it <nubae_> what was it exactly, and what was it coded in? <The_Code> generic yast education module <nubae_> ok so icons for installation/ configuratipon <kl_eisbaer> The_Code: mail asking about the source is out right now <The_Code> configure users to use kiosk/sabayon templates, configure sqid white/blacklists <nubae_> k <The_Code> i think he wrote it in python <The_Code> because he contributed a patch for python ycp bindings <nubae_> oh... ok... well python makes it accesible <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: http://www.jeffshantz.com/?p=40 <nubae_> nubae_ wishes he had more time <The_Code> The_Code too <kl_eisbaer> So one of our two GSoC projects is dead - SLEducator can hopefully tell us something about the other one once he's awake <The_Code> The_Code is wondering why SLEducator is scheduling a meeting while asleep

<kl_eisbaer> 5. Selling openSUSE-Education DVDs <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: any news from your side? <kl_eisbaer> otherwise we can skip that topic <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, not selling it at the moment, demand is low enough that i can afford to give away for free :) <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: hopefully, that will change in the future ;-) <kl_eisbaer> but perhaps we should think about promotion articles like Li-f-e T-Shirts? :-) <The_Code> or dvd's with a printed cover in a box <cyberorg> yeah, aochs_ was supposed to send me some?!! <kl_eisbaer> BTW: I like to give a special THANKS to aochs: he sponsored our Li-f-e T-shirts for LinuxTag! <kl_eisbaer> => AI: aochs: send cyberorg some T-shirts! :-)

<kl_eisbaer> cyberorg, The_Code: status LTSP and Easy-LTSP ? <The_Code> status Easy-LTSP-NG is: i am working on it :) <The_Code> a preview package will come to build service this week <cyberorg> LTSP images got updated using the latest 11.1 updates, -unstable images using 11.2 milestones are also available on oBS <nubae_> edubuntu folks were asking about it the other day <nubae_> seems other distros are eagerly awaiting it <The_Code> btw, anybody tried x2go? <cyberorg> nubae_, btw, kiwi-ltsp images can easily be made distro independent as we do not have to rebuild images <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: thanks for this information - nice to hear <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: perhaps it's time to start building debian/edubuntu ltsp-images to show them? <nubae_> goood idea <nubae_> people dont really believe the power of kiwi <kl_eisbaer> I think OBS has the repositories <kl_eisbaer> but I don't know if kiwi already supports debian <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, naah, they get offended too easily, last time we tried building packages for fedora, someone complained to zonker :D <nubae_> I spent a good 3-4 hours trying to convince alkisg that it could do what he was looking for <nubae_> he kept thinking it was just like a chroot <nubae_> they wont get offended <The_Code> yast module sources: http://code.google.com/p/yast-education/ <nubae_> at least not edubuntu folks <kl_eisbaer> The_Code: that was quick :-) <The_Code> kl_eisbaer, i was surprised as well <The_Code> maybe we should move it to our svn <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: well - if you spend a whole week like the Sidux people to get a booting ISO image, it's sometimes frustrating if other people get it quicker <kl_eisbaer> ;-) <The_Code> as jeff would have to add everybody who would like to contribute <cyberorg> all that is required to run kiwi-ltsp on another distro is a tarball containing /srv/kiwi-ltsp and /srv/tftpboot, adapt xinetd and dhcpd.conf, we have easy-ltsp package for fedora, debian and ubuntu <kl_eisbaer> But that doesn't mean that we can't provide such Images... <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: no - I mean: have a look at their current image for LTSP5 - and produce "the same" one with kiwi <kl_eisbaer> so they see the benefit of automatic builds - without the need to adapt their settings to the "openSUSE specific way" <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, that requires someone from debian and fedora to port kiwi first <kl_eisbaer> jip - that's what I fear <kl_eisbaer> the fedora port shouldn't be a problem, as kiwi already uses smart <kl_eisbaer> but the debian port would be - hrm - interesting <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, package manager is not the issue, someone has to create the boot images descriptions <cyberorg> debian can use smart too <kl_eisbaer> the most interesting thing for the fedora port might be the "installation-images" package which openSUSE uses for the root of the ISO <kl_eisbaer> kl_eisbaer just things about a "Fedora 12 ISO" comming out of the OBS... ;-) <kl_eisbaer> maybe something for another "AI-list" I already have ;-) <The_Code> The_Code for a cool thing in openSUSE install DVDs - boot it and within grub hit F8 and look what happens <nubae_> smart is pretty cross platform from what I understand <nubae_> might be easier to bypass debian and do a ubuntu ppa <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: I think: if it works on one debian derivate, it should work on all ;-) <nubae_> debian policy would never allow kiwi port I dont think <nubae_> yeah <nubae_> but for sure, proof of concept would be great to show <nubae_> whatever the distro be <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: why not? kiwi is GPLv2 <kl_eisbaer> => http://kiwi.berlios.de/ <kl_eisbaer> even not hosted on any Novell/openSUSE related host <nubae_> well, I admit... I'm kind of guessing there... but just got the feeling <kl_eisbaer> jip - sometimes just the name alone makes people think... ;-) <kl_eisbaer> Any other topics we've missed in our Meeting? <The_Code> and even ubuntu/debian people begin to love the openSUSE buildservice, so why not use another tool we have <nubae_> ooof... there seems to be a lot... can u summarise and email us? <nubae_> so we can keep track of tasks <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: ok, will try to do so <nubae_> The_Code, agreed <kl_eisbaer> I think the problem with kiwi (or any other "new" tool): there people using and knowing it are just too small <nubae_> I'll start by changing l-for-e to top level English / deutsch / español <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: thanks <nubae_> think thats important to get contributions to courses going <The_Code> so we have to go out , show and tell them how nice it is <nubae_> heh... a good course would be using kiwi <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: 100 points! :-) <nubae_> using oBS and using Kiwi are definetly needed courses <The_Code> a good point for getting people to use it is by telling you don't have to build all packages for openSUSE but can only build for ubuntu for ex <kl_eisbaer> kiwi comes with a good documentation - but a moodle course would be great <nubae_> well, it needs to be interactive <nubae_> that way people get it better <nubae_> moodle is good like that <nubae_> learn by doing <nubae_> rather than by reading <nubae_> btw, just so u know, there is an edubuntu meeting Friday <nubae_> is there anything I should mention convey there? <nubae_> as I am also involved there a bit... <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: ask them if they want to work together with us? <kl_eisbaer> I don't have any details atm, so this is currently just an overall question <The_Code> that's a good question <kl_eisbaer> nubae_, cyberorg: I think we should ask ms directly in the #kiwi channel if he likes to contribute his course material <nubae_> ms? <kl_eisbaer> ms => Markus Schaefer; the "man behind kiwi" <nubae_> ok <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg already knows him <nubae_> I shall try and talk about linux-for-education at the edubuntu meeting <kl_eisbaer> and I know that he gives some talks and courses here in nuernberg about kiwi already <nubae_> see if they are interested in helping to grow/promote it <kl_eisbaer> nubae_: yes, good point <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, it's already here: http://en.opensuse.org/Build_Service/KIWI/Cookbook <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: you won! Please start a new moodle course about kiwi :-) <nubae_> hehehe <nubae_> nubae_ passes the moodle gloves to cyberorg <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, i wouldn't know where to begin :) <nubae_> sure.... u can do oBS with u're eyes closed, but u have problems with moodle... <nubae_> u cant expect us to believe that <nubae_> :p <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoFdPP8iBAc <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: and, of course: http://www.linux-for-education.org/course/view.php?id=9 <kl_eisbaer> Ha: AI: nubae, cyberorg, lars => produce moodle-course packages in OBS! <nubae_> hmmm can u explain that last one? <cyberorg> i can help with packaging ^^ not sure how courses are installed though, people need mysql connection? not sure it can be handled via rpm <kl_eisbaer> remind our discussion at linuxtag: download the moodle courses from linux-for-education and produce RPM packages from it <cyberorg> nubae_, i can eat oBS but no apatite for moodle :D <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: we need a "PreReq: moodle" for sure <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: the question is if we can invoke the right php file to import the moodle course into a running moodle <cyberorg> it would be nice if someone can create moodle course out of http://en.opensuse.org/Category:LTSP <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: take it as learning challenge for yourself :-) <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, heh, not enough time for learning something that i'd not be using much <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: so let's start using it :-) <nubae_> oh yeah, remember now <nubae_> ok, I can do an LTSP course too, since I'll be doing the cairodock one <cyberorg> kl_eisbaer, if any time is left after doing ltsp and li-f-e images ;) <nubae_> cyberorg, but u need to send me screenshots <kl_eisbaer> cyberorg: ok - I make a note :-) <cyberorg> nubae_, sure, just tell me which ones you need, ping me, i'll do them immediately if around <nubae_> ok

<kl_eisbaer> Anything left to discuss at the moment? <kl_eisbaer> or can we officially finish the meeting? <kl_eisbaer> Note: openSUSE-Project meeting is running on #opensuse-project atm

Ended at: Wed Aug 26 16:47:05 UTC 2009